Sooo. what does everyone think about the Rear mount turbo?

[redbanditZ28]

Just making convo. I'm getting it done to my car. Can't say i have seen anyone on this forum yet that has one. Just wondering what you guys think of it. I'm talking about the Squires system by the way, not texas speed.

[Tsar]

there's a dude here with one

[NJSPEEDER]

they are good kits. i have seen a few STS kits installed. looks really easy and only mild programming is needed to take full advantage.
for packaging i like them, not the same performance potential as having the turbo up front, but still a great way to add some serious power to your car.

[79dizZy28]

what's the difference in potential HP between a front/rear mount turbo?

[qwikz28]

what's the difference in potential HP between a front/rear mount turbo?
not much at all. just a little less efficient. some people swear by the efficiency of a front mount, and some swear by the convenience and reliability of a rear mount. i decided front mount to i can have a muffler

[foff667]

I like the rear mount setups but I don't think the price should be as high as it is. The only problem that i've heard is people having lag especially in stock converter automatics...once the turbo spools it pulls like mad though. Converter & or gears & it'll move one way or the other.

[redbanditZ28]

The only reason i am going with them is because i know it would pass NJ inspection where as Front mounts wouldn't. I mean i don't have the know how to take it off before inspection and i don't feel like paying some one to take it off and none of the Inspection places i go to in my area would pass me with a bribe. I mean the STS rear mount has a CARB number and i even emailed a person who works for NJ inspection asking him if the system would pass and he said it would as long as it had a CARB number. He said no CARB number, No pass. I would have liked the idea of a front mount too, though. Its cool though, going to cartek to get things done. They got 9 second GTOs and vettes using the STS system. And if i gotta pay my mechanic a few bucks every other year to switch the tune, i'd rather do that than just have him yank the whole system out.

[redbanditZ28]

Does anyone know the user name of the guy running the system on his car on here?

[Firebirdgm2000]

orangess has the sts turbo setup....

[Tsar]

2001orangess, but didnt he went overseas for med school?

[qwikz28]

2001orangess, but didnt he went overseas for med school?
i dont know if he left yet or not but i know he hasnt been floatin around the boards that much recently

[ar0ck]

He hasn't left yet, hes still around... somewhere.

[Savage_Messiah]

He leaves in june or july

[JL8Jeff]

They installed one of those systems on 2 Guys Garage on an LS1 car and did dyno tests before and after. I can't remember the numbers but it was pretty good. With the long turbo to intake pipe it allows the charge to cool so no intercooler is needed and it will produce as much or even more boost than a front mount. You don't need a muffler with it because the turbo knocks down the sound of the exhaust. But it seems strange to drive that setup in bad weather.
2 Guys Garage turbo install (http://www.twoguysgarage.com/episodes/index.php?epi=322)

[Brando56894]

hmm now i might actually get one, i always thought that front mounts were far superior then rear mounts. how much would a full kit cost? also you cant really run in excess of 6psi can you or am i wrong? and to jeff: why would it be strange to drive it in bad weather?

[ALLMACK]

Im real curious to know how the thing works out for you.
To me sounds like an awesome idea..but I question the amount of $$ it takes

[Shrek]

you can pick up a total kit for about 4 grand, at 7 psi, not to bad, they are pushing, 394 hp and 449 tq at the wheels...then you can get the upgrade wich requires more tuning, (not sure of the price) and get up to 12 or 15 psi.
12 psi creates close to 600 hp and over 630 lbs tq...at the whells...supposedly...sounds like a great set up to me, i'll be getting one shortly...(hopefully)... here is the link to their site..

www.ststurbo.com

[JL8Jeff]

and to jeff: why would it be strange to drive it in bad weather?

I only say that because the turbo mounts where the muffler would be and driving through rain with a turbo hanging under the car right where the air intake is could lead to problems sucking in water.

[HardcoreZ28]

I believe Chevy High Performance had an article about mounting up an STS kit a month or two ago. You loose about 1.5psi of boost from back to front but as stated earlier it eliminiates the need for an intercooler. Performance wise I've heard nothing but good results. As Jeff stated though they can be a problem in wet conditions. In the CHP test they had an air cleaner sock over the filter and still had problems with it sucking some water. If you don't use your car in bad weather then I say go for it.

[redbanditZ28]

Don't quote me on it, but if you visit the website, i think they now include something with the turbo system to fix that water issue that wasn't included previously in the system.

[Brando56894]

ehh that water issue kinda sucks cuz my bird is my DD :( but for us with low/no money i found this to be pretty cool:

STS Power Financing

Have you been dreaming about a power adder, but don't have the cash?

STS is excited to announce that starting January 24, 2006 we are able to offer financing for our turbo systems, O.A.C.

Please call toll free 866-WE-TURBO (866-938-8726) for more information on how you can boost your car NOW and pay for it over time. With as little as 10% down we can get you boosted today!

and about the water issue:

FAQ (http://www.ststurbo.com/f_a_q)

[Tru2Chevy]

That shield will prolly solve 99% of the water issues with the intake there.

- Justin

[Brando56894]

yea the more and more i read into it the better it sounds :) wonder what the lowest payment rate is for it...

[Savage_Messiah]

yea the more and more i read into it the better it sounds :) wonder what the lowest payment rate is for it...

Yea and I wonder how much it'll cost at a shop fabbing it up... and for Bill to tune it... think about everything

[Brando56894]

but it will still be cheaper/easier then a front mounted turbo, im about 90% sold on this, even though i wont be getting it for awhile...

also what would the shop have to fab up? it bolts right on. if there is any fabbing involved it would only be minor stuff, much much less then what would be needed if you were to install a front mounted one. max cost for the total system including tuning and fabbing would prolly be around 6 grand

[Savage_Messiah]

RJ's car was at TTP for a month or two having his fabbed.

[Tru2Chevy]

RJ's car was at TTP for a month or two having his fabbed.

Didn't he have a bunch of other work done at the same time though?

- Justin

[JL8Jeff]

Why even get a turbo unless you're gonna go all out with a full custom built motor? For modest boost, just go with a supercharger for a heck of a lot less. Any serious boost will destroy a stock engine so no real reason for a turbo at low boost levels. You can just buy one of those ricer electronic devices to make that "whoooossshhh" noise if you really want to hear it.:wink:

[2001orangess]

the fabbing was for the front mount. at the time, there wasn't a front mount kit for the set up therefore it took them awhile to do it.
also, there was a lot of other stuff that was done to my car so therefore it was there for a long time. car made 540 at 10lbs of boost, but like jl8jeff said....any serious boost = broken motor :(

[Savage_Messiah]

Damn that cylinder 7... whatever it is ;)

[Brando56894]

damn rj! 540 horses?? niiiiiice :D

a supercharger would be around the same price wouldnt it? i wouldnt be runnin anything above 5 or 6 psi for awhile..

[JL8Jeff]

You can get a slightly used supercharger kit for $1500-2500 or a new one for $2500-3500. A turbo setup is easily twice that price but the supercharger would be lower boost(4.5-6 lbs) and maybe add 80-100 hp. A turbo has more overall potential for power, but like I said, if you're not getting the motor built for the boost then you're limited to the 4.5-6 lbs of boost. I ran the Powerdyne 4.5 for 4-1/2 years on my old 93 Z28 Indy Pace Car with no problems(42K miles on the supercharger).

[Brando56894]

yea i still have to look into what i want, i wouldnt be getting one until atleast next year. gotta do the supporting mods first :)

[Savage_Messiah]

*cough*supercharger kit for the 3.8??? besides RKCrap???*cough*

[Tru2Chevy]

*cough*supercharger kit for the 3.8??? besides RKCrap???*cough*

There's always the ProCharger....he can copy off of Pathogen and Virus.

- Justin

[Ian]

ProCharger FTW!

[ar0ck]

ProCharger = $$$

Im all for the rear mount, but putting together a used supercharger system will end up costing the same as a new one after you buy all the supporting mods, and track down missing peices.

[JL8Jeff]

ProCharger = $$$

Im all for the rear mount, but putting together a used supercharger system will end up costing the same as a new one after you buy all the supporting mods, and track down missing peices.

There have been 2 setups for sale recently in the $2000-2500 range and one was local here in NJ.

[Brando56894]

ProCharger = $$$

Im all for the rear mount, but putting together a used supercharger system will end up costing the same as a new one after you buy all the supporting mods, and track down missing peices.

:stupid:

[redbanditZ28]

I should have mentioned before that i am either going with either a new 346 block that would be forged or (most likely) an iron 370 ci. I really do plan on taking the system to its limits. When i say limits, i mean having Cartek tweek the system like they did with the GTO and vette they have there. I am a little money conscious however with other things vital to this setup. I mean you need a new rear, new brake setup, new trans, and new suspension. MY plan was just getting the the new engine installed with the turbo system and new transmission and tune. I'd naturally take it easy up until the time i can afford a new rear, brakes and suspension. As it is, i keep the car mostly garaged anyway and i don't nomrally push my car ever to begin with. Hope it all works out though.

[Savage_Messiah]

There's always the ProCharger....he can copy off of Pathogen and Virus.

- Justin

... and be stuck in the 13s for all of eternity?? :rofl:

[Brando56894]

exactly what i was thinkin, that and having things break constantly :lol:

[Tru2Chevy]

... and be stuck in the 13s for all of eternity?? :rofl:

Lol - you better hope Jenn doesn't read that...she is a member here ya know :p

- Justin

[Savage_Messiah]

I know :p if she does read it she knows I'm joking... I hope :lol:

[qwikz28]

alot of people on ls1tech are running 9lbs of boost on the stock bottom end without problems. the turbo/intercooler/meth injection on the stock motor can bring you up to about where RJ is. the main thing LS1s need to worry about is bending a rod.

[qwikz28]

ProCharger FTW!
superchargers are good for making reliable power for less money but turbos are more fun

[V]

screw turbos... ATI prochrager F1 FTW!!!

j/k, im going with the ATI 1-DSC setup wih twin aftercoolers, no need for a cog driven race model(not right now at least) and thatll be on a stroked iron 6.0L block. i really need to stop dragging my feet and finish buying all the components. Turbos are fun, but i LOVE that constant blower whine.

[curt86iroc]

what's the difference in potential HP between a front/rear mount turbo?

a lot. efficiency of a rear mounted blower is significantly less than a front mount.

[79dizZy28]

hmm, i kinda like the idea of throwin one of these LT1 rear mount turbo kits on an LT1 impalla SS :)

[Savage_Messiah]

hmm, i kinda like the idea of throwin one of these LT1 rear mount turbo kits on an LT1 impalla SS :)

You've got one of those??

[2001orangess]

i wanted something different. i seen camaros that went na, super charged and nitrous. there weren't that many turbo ones. so i decided to go turbo. when i 1st got the turbo kit, it was only out for a little bit. that episode with the two guys garage wasn't even out yet. other turbos were still in devlopment. so i went with something that worked.
i also tried to get the most hp with a stock block. i wanted to push that car to its limit. the motor blowing didn't even bother me. if it did, i would just swap it out with something else.


also i wonder how much less effiicent a rear mount is compared to a front mount

[redbanditZ28]

I think it also comes down to Street legal and emissions legal. I mean to say you run a front mount turbocharger is impressive. But when you can run a turbo that is rear mount and have it pass NJ inspection, i think thats even a bigger feat. I'm not saying one is better than the other. Its just that this rear mount gives people the option of keeping it street legal and passing inspection without having to take the whole thing off or paying off some private inspection guy.

[79dizZy28]

You've got one of those??

i wish, but i do need a daily driver and will be shopping around this summer for something along those lines.

[Shrek]

The rear mount turbo is just as efficient, if not more, read the info...there is no need for the intercooler, it still makes the power, and you can safely run larger amounts of boost with out too many problems...this is my opinion, but i'd rather go turbo than blower, and rather go rear than front...but who the hell am i right?

Shrek

[2001orangess]

The rear mount turbo is just as efficient, if not more, read the info...there is no need for the intercooler, it still makes the power, and you can safely run larger amounts of boost with out too many problems...this is my opinion, but i'd rather go turbo than blower, and rather go rear than front...but who the hell am i right?

Shrek

no i understand about the info but its probably from the manufactuer..i mean does the tornado really give you hp

[Brando56894]

no i understand about the info but its probably from the manufactuer..i mean does the tornado really give you hp

the dyno in the infomercial says it does :D :lol:

[curt86iroc]

The rear mount turbo is just as efficient, if not more, read the info...there is no need for the intercooler, it still makes the power, and you can safely run larger amounts of boost with out too many problems...this is my opinion, but i'd rather go turbo than blower, and rather go rear than front...but who the hell am i right?

Shrek

a rear mount is in no way as efficient as a front mount. remember, the longer you pump a fluid, the more frictional loss will occur. if you look at a front and rear mount turbo, both with the same rotor diameter, rpm and flow rate, the front mount will be more "efficient."

now, if you are talking mechanical eficiency (which i do not think you are) then you are correct. the mechanical efficiencies would be equal.

[Shrek]

yes, actually i was talking about both, i understand that there will be some hp loss, but the loss isn't great enough to really give a ****... I was talking about how far the boost has to travel, most people are like wtf? but it eliminates the need for the intercooler...doesn't sound to inefficient to me...and as far as the research goes, this is actually doing research on the product, not what the manufacturer has to say, yes i posted a link to their website, but there have been several articles in magazines as well as on tv...

Shrek

[JL8Jeff]

There really isn't a hp loss because they mount a different turbo at the rear vs the front. It's a complete package and if it's designed for 100 hp then they put a turbo in that will make 100 hp. Obviously, the same turbo mounted at the rear will make less powere than the same turbo mounted up front, but that's why they run a different turbo in the rear. No need for an intercooler so it can run more boost than the same turbo mounted up front. I would rather have a pair of front mount turbos than run all the extra stuff for a rear mount. If was gonna run extra piping under the car, it would have to be for a true dual exhaust setup, not a rear turbo. But that's just me.

[qwikz28]

There really isn't a hp loss because they mount a different turbo at the rear vs the front. It's a complete package and if it's designed for 100 hp then they put a turbo in that will make 100 hp. Obviously, the same turbo mounted at the rear will make less powere than the same turbo mounted up front, but that's why they run a different turbo in the rear. No need for an intercooler so it can run more boost than the same turbo mounted up front. I would rather have a pair of front mount turbos than run all the extra stuff for a rear mount. If was gonna run extra piping under the car, it would have to be for a true dual exhaust setup, not a rear turbo. But that's just me.
and the piping runs where subframe connectors will go so you would have to ditch those or only run them on one side. that was a HUGE deciding factor for me

[Tru2Chevy]

and the piping runs where subframe connectors will go so you would have to ditch those or only run them on one side. that was a HUGE deciding factor for me

That depends on the piping and the sfc's....I've seen pics of setups where there just incorporated the mounting tabs for the pipe into the sfc mount. I should have saved them.....

- Justin

[2001orangess]

or if you don;t have a sub frame, you can get one side done when you get the kit done :P

btw if there was front turbo set up back than that didn;t costover 6 grand (i think it was qmp and i think it was that much) i would have bought that instead

[Ian]

here is my take on this:

the front mount turbo will always be more efficient than the rear mount. why? because its the expanding hot exhaust gases that spin the turbo, not simply the volume of it and how fast its coming out (although those two do play a role in it). the rear mount is further away and therefore the exhaust cools down a lot by the time it gets there. the front mount is only a foot or so down stream from the head so the exhaust is still expanding, meaning it will spool faster and create more boost.

the rear mount doesnt need an intercooler because the pressurized air has to travel the length of the car to get where its going. While this is helpful, it also means the turbo has to make more boost than a front mount because it has more pipe to pressurize that a front mount. so a front mounted turbo wouldn't have to work as hard as a rear mounted one would. the intercooler used in front mount applications isnt really that huge of a restriction, and even if it is, the fact that the front mount is more efficient will porvide enough pressure to where the restriction isnt a big deal.

also, I'm not too crazy about running an oil line all the way to the back of the car. I'm sure its shielded, but I'm just not comfortable with it. however, it does create a nice drop in oil temp by the time it gets back there.

the last thing is the price. there are a lot of guys making their own front mount turbo kits with truck manifolds flipped upside down. that obviously makes it a bit cheaper than buying turbo manifolds. but you just cant beat the price and convieniance (sp?) of the sts rear mount setup.

thats my story and I'm sticking to it! :)