want to do something about gasoline prices?

[jims69camaro]

go here (http://capwiz.com/sosnow/issues/alert/?alertid=11571321).

:soapbox:
there really shouldn't be any discussion about this. either you will or you won't. if you won't, no one is really interested in your excuses. it's like the people who don't vote but spend the next four years complaining about who is in office. no one cares. so go there, sign up, try to do something about our current situation instead of just sitting back crying about how bad things are all of the time. /soapbox

[WildBillyT]

The first sentence seems incorrect to me. I doubt there will be a big market correction.

[edpontiac91]

DONE-WHO KNOWS WTF IT WILL DO! Do nothing or something, it doesn't seem to matter. The ASHOLDS:moon: who are buying oil stock are making MONEY, what they don't realize is that EVERYTHING they BUY is going up in cost because of what they are doing. So in the end they are losing money along with the rest of us. It's a dog chasing its tail. At what time period or when the entire economy comes to a grinding halt will this madness end. Will every single SEARS/J.C.PENNY/KOHLS/TARGET/LOWES/HOME DEPOT/MACY's/Shop-Rite and so forth go down in flames and leave us with one HUGE Wal-Mart to take care of all of our needs? Will we EVER see $3.00 a gallon for gas again? NOOOOOOOOOOOOO:rofl:, the oil companies got to one of their goals!!! They just had to see how FAR they could push us before we REALLY got pissed off and it seems that $4.00 a gallon is the straw that broke the camels back. Or so it seems. This could just be a breather before the next round takes off. :evil:

[jims69camaro]

i agree 100% ed.

[Tru2Chevy]

Who knows how much it will help, but if enough people get the bug in the ears of the politicians, they tend to listen (especially with an upcoming election).

- Justin

[DaSkinnyGuy]

I have done something like this already now I get letters in the mail from one of those guys on the list.

[firehawk1120]

funny all those politicians were DEMOCRAPS.

[Knipps]

done.

[mtnhopper1]

I've been saying this is the cause of the spike in prices since the beginning of it! When the mortgage-backed securities market tanked, all of that investment capital went into the next-safest market - the commodities market! When that much money enters a market all at the same time, the prices skyrocket. It's economics 101.

It also translates to higher prices for corn, wheat, milk, OJ, etc, etc. Sound familiar?

I'm really glad that this kind of stuff is getting out there. Too many people believe this is a supply problem. That is only a small part of the problem, and nothing has changed on that front for years. The recent spike is a MARKET problem. We're not running out of oil, wheat, corn, etc. Speculators are driving the price up. It's the same dynamic as the housing market.

Do a google search of "commodities investment" and see how much has been written about the recent "boom." It seems to be the only segment that's doing well, and the rest of the economy is suffering for it. When it collapses, you won't be able to give away a barrel of oil, farmers will go broke, etc etc. It's the early 80s all over again.

[jims69camaro]

things can only go so high and then they come back down. only when they come back down they tend to crash. knowing that there are people out there that their only real concern is money and they could care less how they get it reinforces my belief that people can be real scumbags when they want to. there is no supply problem - exactly the opposite is true, there is a surplus and the refineries are OVER-producing. i wrote a bit on this in the first thread that came out about gas prices. i did a little research and found out that they are having to cut back on some of the refineries because we have too much gasoline production. then to hear the president get on national TV and tell the american public that the price hike is due to a shortage... i wanted to reach through the screen and strangle him.

[Frosty]

Jim, I'd really like to see proof that we're overproducing gasoline, Not a single report I've read has ever said that. I'd be interested to see some articles :)

...and I swear, if I hear one more person blame the oil companies I'm going to f'in scream. I guess because Nancy Pelosi and Maxine Waters says it's their fault it must be true lol

[89 Trans Am WS6]

Like ive said many times in the past the people making the real money in all of this are the credit card companies.

Some of you may or may not believed how much we lose to the big CC boys but it should be more and more apparent now with alot of stations going cash only. I took a ride up to clinton road about a week or so ago and noted a TON of cash only stations on 23.

Definitly a good strategy if you are allowed to do it. Some places, like the shop I work at cant. We are a company owned sunoco station that my godfather pays rent at. Hes been doing it for 20+ years at the same location in elmwood park. In our case since its owned by Sunoco they wont allow us to go cash only or post a seperate cash price.

Its gotten to the point we are getting out of the gas thing and opening a new shop to concentrate on just automotive work. The gas game isnt worth it anymore. I know alot of people think the gas stations are making a killing during this stuff, but its really not the case. After all is said and done on a credit card purchase we make around 7 cents on regular. Add that to the 30ish grand that each tanker load of fuel costs every 3 or so days (which sunoco drafts electronicly from your checkbook when it leaves the depot, not when its delivered) and its really not worth it at all.

Aside from various tiny places here and there the cheapest way to get fuel, sunoco fuel anyway would be on the turnpike. There is less tax on the fuel since its a toll road, the price can only be changed once a week(as opposed to non turnpike/parkway stations that can change prices once every 24 hours), AND I do believe if you go to the sunoco in the vince lombardi service station you can actually go there and back without ever paying a toll if you are going the right direction... I guess if you were local it wouldnt be to bad of an idea.

This isnt to say speculators on wall street, shortages/over production, enviromentalists, etc dont all have a hand in setting the price of fuel, just dont forget the silent giants that make 3ish percent on EVERYTHING without doing a thing. Thats what really adds up.

[Frosty]

Joe that's a great point, why isn't our government looking at credit card companies and their obscene profits? Why aren't they threatening to take their "windfall" profits. I mean certainly that's not fair and reasonable right?

Ohhhhh that's right, they're not being made the scapegoat for this situation. Our government would rather point the finger at someone else rather than admit that they f'ed up, they ignored warnings for decades, they've had their head in the sand for far too long and now we're all paying for it. :mad:

[jims69camaro]

tony, it was a while back. do a search on gas prices or something, or just look back at the posts i've made in order to find it. i'm too tired and in too much pain to attempt anything tonight.

but, of note, something reported on consumeraffairs.com:
AIRLINES JOIN EFFORT TO LIMIT OIL SPECULATORS
Despite mounting evidence that speculators were driving up the price of oil to profit off lucrative contracts for oil futures, both Wall Street and the White House said that it would be irresponsible to, well, speculate on such an idea. But the airline industry, stung by reductions in service and fare hikes to cover fuel costs, is taking that risk. The executives in charge of 12 major airlines have published an open letter to consumers on the StopOilSpeculation.com Web site urging them to push Congress to limit oil speculation in the hope of pushing prices down. Read more... (http://list-manage.com/track/click?u=48290de6249ef2cecba9fe5de&id=d99dfecc7b&e=03343cf7d5)

the cliff's notes: 12 major airlines have posted to the website in the OP. they're behind the movement to get the speculators off of oil, or put some rules into effect that would limit the amount the actual price of gasoline is affected by their actions.

[Frosty]

I'll give a search, thanks Jim!

As I've said before though, we've made our bed....time to sleep in it. For decades we ignored the warnings, we ignored the advice. Now we're at the mercy of people that could care less about our country. We give power to those that aim to hurt us, we've let other countries do what we were too politically correct to do. Very un-American if you ask me. We have the power to vote, we have the power to elect those to speak for us...but how can we vote for those people when they all suck? How can we vote for those to speak for us when they all care about lining their pockets with $$$ or when they give the special interest groups a louder voice.

I need another drink. :D

[jims69camaro]

I'll give a search, thanks Jim!

As I've said before though, we've made our bed....time to sleep in it. For decades we ignored the warnings, we ignored the advice. Now we're at the mercy of people that could care less about our country. We give power to those that aim to hurt us, we've let other countries do what we were too politically correct to do. Very un-American if you ask me. We have the power to vote, we have the power to elect those to speak for us...but how can we vote for those people when they all suck? How can we vote for those to speak for us when they all care about lining their pockets with $$$ or when they give the special interest groups a louder voice.

I need another drink. :D

this is why i do so much research on each candidate. people ask me why i put so much effort into it when most running for office should be behind bars, and i tell them i am looking for the lesser of the evils. i'm still a registered democrat, and in the most recent primary they wouldn't let me vote for the republican, so i just left that space blank. there are those on both sides of the fence that can help us, if properly motivated. we need to speak with one voice right about now, in order to get them to stop fu***ng us.

[jims69camaro]

Dear Jim,

On several occasions in the past few months, I have written about the impact of skyrocketing fuel prices on airline customers – in their daily lives and when they travel (Final Approach May 1 and Final Approach May 28 ). In the long run, to lower oil prices for all Americans, we need to increase domestic supply, increase exploration, alternative energy sources and conservation. However, one near-term solution to the problem is for government to investigate and rein in oil speculators.

What is the Commodities Market? – Commodities are raw materials purchased by manufacturers of finished products such as food manufacturers, oil refiners or builders. Businesses that are highly dependent on oil – refineries, heating oil dealers, airlines and trucking companies among others – lessen their risk of significant price fluctuations by purchasing future delivery contracts at predetermined prices in what is known as the commodities or futures markets. The two largest U.S. commodities markets or futures exchanges are the Chicago Mercantile Exchange and the New York Mercantile Exchange, where people trade standardized futures contracts; that is, a contract to buy specific quantities of a commodity at a specified price with delivery set at a specified time in the future.

What is the Problem with Oil? – There is a significant disconnect between the paper market for oil (speculators) and the physical market for oil (consumers). In recent years, speculators have taken advantage of actual consumers of oil by bidding up the price for futures contracts. If a speculator purchases a contract for delivery of oil at a high price six or 12 months in the future but has no intention of actually taking delivery of the oil in that contract, then a physical customer who needs that oil – to deliver home heating oil, to operate trucks or airplanes, or even to process in a refinery – will be forced to pay the higher price in order to obtain the oil that is needed.

How Do They Get Away with That? – Increasingly, sophisticated institutional investors have managed to manipulate the rules and regulations governing commodities transactions through a series of exemptions and waivers, including the so-called “Enron loophole,” low margin requirements and the dodging of U.S. public disclosure requirements. These complex arrangements have a similar impact: They put people engaged in oil-related businesses at a disadvantage with those who gamble relatively small sums that the price of oil will increase out of proportion to marketplace demands. If that happens, as it has regularly over the past few years, those who need oil for their businesses pay a premium, which is passed on to you – the consumer.

What Can Government Do Now? – In the near term, Congress needs to address the impact of unchecked speculation in the commodities market.

Commodities trading is overseen by a small, but very powerful government agency known as the Commodities Futures Trading Commission (CFTC) . Congress can require the CFTC to implement a host of controls such as imposing limits on the quantity of commodities contracts speculators may purchase, closing the loopholes that allow speculators to trade exempt from any government oversight or regulation, and requiring reporting by those who are engaging in speculation.

Experts say that closing regulatory loopholes in the trading of commodity futures will result in a significant reduction in fuel prices.

What’s Next? – Congress is expected to debate some of these issues in the next few weeks and it is urgent that they hear your voice. To facilitate public participation in the debate over speculators, we have launched a broad-based coalition, S.O.S. NOW, that provides a wide array of information on speculation and its impact on the price we all pay for oil. S.O.S. NOW stands for Stop Oil Speculation Now, and we urge you to go to the Web site www.stopoilspeculationnow.com and send a message to Congress about oil speculation.

Sincerely,


James C. May
President and CEO
Air Transport Association

[jims69camaro]

http://capwiz.com/sosnow/issues/alert/?alertid=11637491&queueid=[capwiz:queue_id]

[Knipps]

I got a reply today thanking me for the email :lol:

-

[jims69camaro]

I got a reply today thanking me for the email :lol:

-

you mean someone is actually paying attention to us?

[Knipps]

you mean someone is actually paying attention to us?

:shrug: it's pretty scripted.. may just mean it was opened

Thank you for contacting my office. I appreciate the opportunity to hear and understand your views and concerns.

It is an honor and a privilege to represent you in the United States House of Representatives.

Should you have any additional comments about this or any other issues, please do not hesitate to contact me in my Washington, D.C. office at (202) 225-4465. Also, you can access Thomas.loc.gov from my website (www.house.gov/garrett) to obtain additional information on legislative issues.

Thank-you again for your e-mail. It is through your comments that I am better able to represent the people of New Jersey in Congress.

Sincerely,
Scott Garrett
Member of Congress
5th District, New Jersey

[jims69camaro]

oh yeah, that smells like a form letter. probably an auto-response. whatever, i know we're getting some pretty good exposure when it lands on CNN.

[Knipps]

Man, this guy loves me.. I got a letter in the mail today with the US Senate letterhead and everything :lol:

[Tru2Chevy]

I got an email from Rush Holt:

Dear Mr. Bowers:



Thank you for contacting me about oil speculation. I appreciate hearing from you, and I apologize for the delay in my reply.



As you may know, the speculation in energy markets has been identified as one of the principle causes of the increase in the price of oil. As American consumers continue to pay nearly $4 at the pump, speculators in the energy marketplace are making millions in the commodities and futures markets. Experts have testified in Congress that speculation in the marketplace has increased the price of oil by $20 to $60 per barrel, and the International Monetary Fund recently concluded that "speculation has played a significant role in the run up in energy prices."



The government body in charge of regulating commodities is the Commodities Futures Trading Commission (CFTC), which Congress established in 1974 to prevent fraudulent futures transactions. However, loopholes in current law prevent the CFTC from being an effective regulatory agency. In 2000, the CFTC was made less effective by the passage of the Commodities Futures Modernization Act which included energy in the class of commodities exempt from CFTC regulation. Exempt commodities can be traded in the Over the Counter (OTC) market without regulation as long as small investors do not participate. The so called "Enron-loophole" and a lack of regulation of the marketplace have caused deceptive trading practices to flourish, including creating the artificial appearance of demand to drive up energy prices. In fact, a recent report by Lehman Brothers estimates that that up to 50 percent of the price of a barrel of oil can be attributed to speculation in the energy futures marketplace.



On July 30, 2008, the House of Representatives considered H.R. 6604, the Commodity Market Transparency and Accountability Act, legislation which would take dramatic steps to curb excessive oil speculation. H.R. 6604 would make off-shore commodities markets subject to the same rules and regulations as United States markets. It would close the "Enron Loophole" by giving the CFTC the ability to regulate the OTC market. It would limit the size of the stake that a single investor can hold in a given market. H.R. 6604 also would expand the CFTC so that it would have more resources for regulating the commodities marketplace and create an independent office of the Inspector General of the CFTC. I supported the Commodity Market Transparency and Accountability Act. However, many of my Republican colleagues did not support this legislation and it failed to pass under a rule which required a two-thirds majority by a vote of 276 - 151.



I recently supported H.R. 6377, the Energy Markets Emergency Act of 2008, which would help the CFTC prosecute excessive speculation, price distortion, unwarranted changes in prices, or other unlawful activities that are causing major disturbances in the oil market. This bill passed the House with my support and is pending consideration in the Senate. I have attached a copy of my remarks on this bill that you might find to be of interest.



Several other bills have been introduced in the 110th Congress to strengthen the CFTC and to increase regulation of energy commodity markets. Rep. Bart Stupak (D-MI) has introduced H.R. 594, the Prevent Unfair Manipulation of Prices Act of 2007, which would amend the CEA to allow it to regulate energy transactions made in an electronic trading facility, as well as energy commodities traded in OTC transactions. Another bill, H.R. 4066, the Close the Enron Loophole Act, introduced by Rep. Peter Welch (D-VT), would require the reporting of large positions in energy commodity trading in the OTC market and on foreign markets that can be accessed by terminals based in the United States. This bill would also extend the ability of the CFTC to regulate the trading of exempt commodities on an energy trading center's electronic trading facility. Both of these bills have been referred to the House Committee on Agriculture for further consideration.



Again thank you for contacting me. As the House of Representatives continues to work on this issue, I will be sure to keep your thoughts in mind.

Sincerely,

RUSH HOLT

Member of Congress

I have the .pdf with his comments that I'll send to anyone who may be interested....

- Justin

[Knipps]

If I had a scanner I'd upload the letter I got via snail mail

(explains how CAFE standards are less for envirmental reasons, and more to save consumers $)

[cdacda13]

I got a 3 page letter from Menendez.

[88IrocVert]

DONE
Now I don't know if its true, but when the gas prices first started to go up, I heard the oil companies were able to inflate prices to generate bigger profits for more refineries and repairs to refineries damaged by Katrina. They talk about demand making prices go up, I don't doubt this was part of their argument. If it is or isn't I doubt all that money is really going to that. It sounded like a "foot in the door" to abuse a bad situation from a natural disaster from the begining. I always hated the "one way" excuses about price fluctuations. The price of gas goes up the same day oil prices go up, but when the oil prices drop, we don't see the gas prices drop. We need some kind of regulation to stop getting screwed.

[Knipps]

from Frank Lautenberg

Dear Mr. Knipping:



Thank you for contacting me about the "Stop Excessive Energy Speculation Act of 2008" (S. 3268). I am proud to be a cosponsor of this important legislation.



The "Stop Excessive Energy Speculation Act 2008," introduced by Senator Reid (D-NV), would help to reduce the amount of excessive speculation taking place in the oil markets and raising the price of gasoline at the pumps. This legislation would increase the resources and authority needed by the Commodities Futures Trading Commission (CFTC) to detect, prevent, and punish price manipulation and excessive speculation and give the CFTC emergency authority needed to rapidly implement the legislation. The "Stop Excessive Energy Speculation Act of 2008" would also strengthen the amount and quality of information available to the CFTC so that the Commission can better regulate all aspects of the energy futures markets.



In addition, this legislation would provide better transparency in the trading of energy derivatives by closing the so-called "London Loophole" so that oil traders using a foreign exchange cannot manipulate the price of oil in the United States. The "Stop Excessive Energy Speculation Act of 2008" would also require the CFTC to implement position limits to restrict excessive speculation that would still allow for reasonable trading for price discovery, liquidity, and legitimate hedging purposes. This important legislation will create necessary transparency in energy futures trading and help American consumers.



Please be assured that I will support this legislation when it comes before the full Senate for a vote. Thank you again for contacting me.

At least we know they're getting the message :lol:

[cdacda13]

^ I just got the same one.

[Tru2Chevy]

I got that letter from Lautenberg too

- Justin