2012 Z28....

[iroc86NJ]

Just got this months Motor Trend in the mail. I'm reading the article on the Hurst Edition Camaro and see the side has some other special edition Camaros listed with estimated pricing. MT says the new Z28 will go for 60k!.

Personally i think MT is crazy for thinking the new Z will command vette money. Has anyone heard about pricing on the new Z? IMO GM will probably put an MSRP of 45K on the base model.

[NJ346]

It will command vette $$.

Go here to find out why: http://www.njfboa.org/forums/showthread.php?t=52382

[Frosty]

Why is it crazy that it will command 'vette money? It'll be faster than a base C6.

[BigAls87Z28]

GT500 commands Vette money? Gunna be a lot of stuff on kthis car.

[sweetbmxrider]

http://hackapc.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/command-prompt-glossy1-300x293.png

[Slow-V6]

Why is it crazy that it will command 'vette money? It'll be faster than a base C6.

Because its a Camaro maybe? If I had the choice of getting a Vette or a camaro for 60k I would get the Vette!

Still looks okay at best!

[r0nin89]

Because its a Camaro maybe? If I had the choice of getting a Vette or a camaro for 60k I would get the Vette!


But thats you. I'm 6'5" and I dont fit in a vette so why would I want a cramped little sports car to go fast when I could go fast comfortably in a z28?

AND even if it takes a 100,000 vette to intrigue me, only takes a 60,000 camaro to make me drool.

[Slow-V6]

But thats you. I'm 6'5" and I dont fit in a vette so why would I want a cramped little sports car to go fast when I could go fast comfortably in a z28?

AND even if it takes a 100,000 vette to intrigue me, only takes a 60,000 camaro to make me drool.


More power to you! If you wanna drop 60 grand on a Camaro then go right ahead.

At 6'5 you wouldnt fit very well in a Camaro either. I am 5'10 and have to put the seat all the way back to feel comfortable in my firebirds.

[iroc86NJ]

Firstly - Al- the GT500 is Fords halo car so I understand the high price. Plus people pay stupid money for anything associated with Shelby.

Second - The Z28 will be faster then the base vette in a straight line, but at 60K we're not talking about a base vette. IMO There is no way the Z28 will be faster then the Grand Sport.

[Frosty]

I gotta laugh at some people...can GM do anything right? Like any of us broke asses can afford a $45K car let alone $60K....so what's it matter?

So basically, in your eyes, any performance car regardless of options should be priced under a Corvette? The Z28 is a direct competitor for the GT500...which.....is priced over a Corvette so what is the big deal? Not everyone wants a Corvette. Would I personally buy a Z28 over a Corvette? It depends, I would if it was a 1LT 'vette...if it was a fully loaded GS then no. The Corvette is a 2-seater with limited cargo storage and is a nightmare to park anywhere in public. The Camaro is at least something you could drive every day. So, to compare the two isn't fair, it's apples to oranges.

It's not that cut and dry...while the Corvette is GM's flagship car it's not the baseline for performance pricing.

To suggest it should be at $45K is downright comical, a fully loaded 2SS/RS is around 40K, so you're saying GM should offer the LSA and associated upgrades for a mere $5K? :rofl: Lets even downgrade the options on a SS for a bit, at $35K it's still only a $10K option for the motor? You can't even buy the motor from GM that cheap.

The GT500, fully loaded tops out at around $58K with dealers jacking those prices up bad.

So lets say Motor Trend overshot the price by $5K, even at $55K it's STILL in line with the competition. Everyone wants something for nothing, this car won't exactly be cheap to build and it's not going to be built for people like us that want a Camaro, it's for the upper echelon of guys that want something to run against the GT500's of the world.

[NastyEllEssWon]

60k is way too much for a camaro. honestly for that price id rather get a V-2 if i was looking for 4 seats and a supercharged sporty car. GM is just overstepping all their bounds and pricing themselves out of the game. Ford has priced itself under everything that gm offers and OFFERS A BETTER PRICE.


imo one of the big reasons i fell in love with the fbody in the first place was the BANG FOR THE BUCK it represented. Ford now offers the most bang for your buck. GM needs to get on the ball and stop pricing themselves out of their target ranges.

[LTb1ow]

60k is way too much for a camaro. honestly for that price id rather get a V-2 if i was looking for 4 seats and a supercharged sporty car. GM is just overstepping all their bounds and pricing themselves out of the game. Ford has priced itself under everything that gm offers and OFFERS A BETTER PRICE.


imo one of the big reasons i fell in love with the fbody in the first place was the BANG FOR THE BUCK it represented. Ford now offers the most bang for your buck. GM needs to get on the ball and stop pricing themselves out of their target ranges.


Which is it? :lol:

I think a lot of you are neglecting inflation, last time a new camaro was made was quite a long time and a few recessions ago...

If I had 60k and didn't need it, sure, I would get a new camaro over the Vette, but IMO, that same stature symbol the vette represents now is being replicated with the new camaro.

Bunch of either rich young ********, or old guys who cruise in it and think nothing else is near the awesomeness of their car.

Driving a 5th gen as a daily would make my 4th gen seem like a miata, would be a nice change.
:rofl:

[Frosty]

Wait, the GT500 is almost 60K, the Z28, going by MT is around $60K....so how has Ford offered something for under GM's price? It's all speculation at this point but naturally everyone here is a marketing and pricing guru.

So by everyone's opinion here the GT500 is garbage too because it's priced more than a Corvette, right? What's good for the goose is good for the gander, no?

.....and just to play Devil's advocate here....many would say $60K is too much for ANY Chevy and that $120K for a ZR1 is outrageous regardless of its performance. Just sayin'...

[LTb1ow]

Wait, the GT500 is almost 60K, the Z28, going by MT is around $60K....so how has Ford offered something for under GM's price? It's all speculation at this point but naturally everyone here is a marketing and pricing guru here.

So by everyone's opinion here the GT500 is garbage too because it's priced more than a Corvette, right? What's good for the goose is good for the gander, no?

.....and just to play Devil's advocate here....many would say $60K is too much for ANY Chevy and that $120K for a ZR1 is outrageous regardless of its performance. Just sayin'...

http://images.icanhascheezburger.com/completestore/2008/10/14/128684806492400597.jpg

[Frosty]

:rofl:

[LTb1ow]

But yes, 120k for a car, that is also a GM.. is slightly crazy.

But, eh, guess if they raise the price, people will think they make good cars?

Resident GM guy where art thou?

[NastyEllEssWon]

yes the gt500 is in vette price range but its FORDS TOP CAR at the moment. the gt500 IS THE CORVETTE in Fords fleet, so it can command that type of car. Gm asking 10k more than their flagship cars base model for a top model camaro is just insane. whats next? a 40k dollar economy car??? oh yeah i forgot, thats on the way in the name of the Volt. and yes we have had quite the recession in the last few years, which is funny that gm keeps driving their prices up and out of the range of their target demographic.


i look forward to hearing what the watercooler has to say about this.

[LTb1ow]

yes the gt500 is in vette price range but its FORDS TOP CAR at the moment. the gt500 IS THE CORVETTE in Fords fleet, so it can command that type of car. Gm asking 10k more than their flagship cars base model for a top model camaro is just insane. whats next? a 40k dollar economy car??? oh yeah i forgot, thats on the way in the name of the Volt. and yes we have had quite the recession in the last few years, which is funny that gm keeps driving their prices up and out of the range of their target demographic.


i look forward to hearing what the watercooler has to say about this.

recession = weaker money.

weaker money = inflated prices.

Simple.

[Frosty]

Wait, so because Ford doesn't have their version of a Corvette $60K for the GT500 is OK? But because GM has a Corvette $60K for a Z28 is insane? I'm confused.

GT500@$60K=good

GM building a car to combat previously mentioned GT500@$60K=bad.

:confused:

The Corvette is a different type of car, different audience, different purpose.

As bad as Al is up GM's ass some of you guys are a complete 180

So lets say MT is completely wrong and the Z28 starts at $50K...then what? That puts it around $5K more than a base 1LT Corvette....is it suddenly built by God or is it still bad because it's an expensive Camaro that's not even designed to target the average Camaro owner?

[BigAls87Z28]

What the hell? Volt is not an economy car you dolt. Camaro is affordable but sorry the top of the line model isn't. Since when does GM or Chevrolet have to fit the price under another vehicle? The Z28 will not be 60k but will be priced like the GT500 is just like how all the Camaro models are priced compared to its equivilant Mustang. This is a rediculious thread. Not everything has to be affordable.

[Frosty]

Heh, he said volt and dolt...he's a poet and didn't even know it.

OK, that is my corny joke for the night.

[NastyEllEssWon]

ive been saying this since day 1. the camaro is an overpriced, brick shaped piece of trash that offers you a car the size of a 4 door sedan without any of the interior room and some of the worst styling cues this side of the new millenium.


seriously it looks like 3 different people designed the front, the rear and the side and when it rolled off the assembly line they forgot to put rear backup lights on it and just drilled in some squares in the middle of the bumper.


for the price that its projected for this z28 id rather go buy a vette or a cts-v. everyone gets up on SLP's ass for asking 60k for a Firehawk G8 but suddenly you take the same car, same options, slap on an uglier body, take away 60 percent of the interior space, cramp up the outward visibility and slap a bowtie on the front and its ok????


the camaro is a fail as it is....theyre just adding more as they go. :nod:

[BigAls87Z28]

Facepalm.
And GM is pricing itself out of the segment? Is that why Camaro is# 1? Just asking. Mustangs price is now right online with Camaros overpriced models.

[BigAls87Z28]

ive been saying this since day 1. the camaro is an overpriced, brick shaped piece of trash that offers you a car the size of a 4 door sedan without any of the interior room and some of the worst styling cues this side of the new millenium.


seriously it looks like 3 different people designed the front, the rear and the side and when it rolled off the assembly line they forgot to put rear backup lights on it and just drilled in some squares in the middle of the bumper.


for the price that its projected for this z28 id rather go buy a vette or a cts-v. everyone gets up on SLP's ass for asking 60k for a Firehawk G8 but suddenly you take the same car, same options, slap on an uglier body, take away 60 percent of the interior space, cramp up the outward visibility and slap a bowtie on the front and its ok????


the camaro is a fail as it is....theyre just adding more as they go. :nod:

What you just blabbed out there is opinion. None of it is based in fact. Its like watching Fox News.

Fact: Camaro is #1, with a majority of its sales going to the overpriced and out of its target demographic market SS models.

Fact, 2002 Camaro SS's also cost 30k and up. Loaded Anniversery 02 with the stripes and all topped over 35k.

Fact, the 2010 Camaro Im driving has a sticker price of a little over 37k, but offers way more in features and way more refinement.

Fact: Drilling usually leaves round holes. The reverse lights are square

Fact:
http://www.autonationals.com/images/nc-69-camaro-rs-z28-2.jpg

Its a retro touch, like the rest of the car.

Fact: MotorTrend knows as much about the pricing of this car as you do, which is needless to say...nothing. And their perspective on it is already 4 months old by the time you read the ink.

Z28 will be priced accordingly, I figure around the 50k mark. Will you be able to load it up to 60k? Convertable models? Sure.
Will it be for everyone? No, and it shouldnt be. The Z28 is a supercar for all intents and purpses.

So what Ford doesnt have a Corvette type car, thats Chevrolet's problem? So that means that since Chevrolet does have a Corvette, that they have to ask less?

Recession? Rich are still rich last time I checked. I havent seen any millionairs turning in thier Benz's for Aveos.
The rich are who are gunna buy this car, like the GT500 are. I dont see your average working man making 50k a year picking up a GT500.
Next we are gunna hear how stupid GM is for putting in features like air bags, AC, radio, OnStar, hell...leather seats with heat in this car. The gall of these ********!

While you guys are under a rock, the automotive world was moving forward out of the 60's. Its pretty compeditive out there.

[Frosty]

I'd like to amend some of my points. Al pretty much echoed some of them. There is no way I could live with myself if we agreed on things.

So GT500 good. Z28 garbage...GM sucks.

:D

[sweetbmxrider]

i didn't read all of your diarrhea nasty but you said chevy priced themselves out of the competition and all this other nonsense. so what about the ford gt? its a very rare car to see and is marketed to a different person. whats so different with a zr1?

some people have money and just don't give a ****. sometimes companies create things just to get their name circulating. maybe thats why so many 5th gens are tooling around? maybe there is more to it than anyone on here can bitch in every thread about?


maybe i'm just an idiot? :|

[r0nin89]

GT500 is not fords competition for a Corvette. Stop looking at prices and going "O well the GT500 is fast and $60,000 and so is the vette. They must be competing models!"

The fact of the matter is that the GT500 has been available with no GM competition. Dont forget that the GT500 is still just a $60,000 mustang just like the z28 will be a $60,000 Camaro. Comparing the vette to a mustang is like comparing apples and oranges. Theyre not in the same realm, at all.

If your all so upset that ford doesnt have competition for a corvette then why dont you write them and tell them to start producing Cobras or GT40s for the price of an entry level vette. By the logic here that would make everything make sense somehow.

[Slow-V6]

1st off I would hope a car with a 550 hp motor would be faster then a car with a 430hp motor.

In my opinion the LS1 Camaros were faster then the LS1 Vettes but they were still 20+ grand less in price. I remember everyone complaining on how over priced those 4th gen cars were. My WS6 was 34,000 brand new. Hell my 95 Firehawk was 35,000 brand new.

Its 60,000 for a Camaro. Would you have spent 60k for a 2002 Camaro? How about a 95 Camaro? 3rd gen? I know I wouldnt. So why would I be interested in a 5th gen for 60,000? Just like when those guys first bought there GT500's. They are cool cars but when they told me how much they spent on them I had to laugh my ass off.


maybe thats why so many 5th gens are tooling around? maybe there is more to it than anyone on here can bitch in every thread about?
:|

I like the 5th gen for the price that the V6 and SS are at. 24,000-40,000 is a good price for a new Camaro. I am sure if all the 5th gens camaros would have started at 55,000 then they would have sold a hell of alot less.

Everyone wants something for nothing, this car won't exactly be cheap to build and it's not going to be built for people like us that want a Camaro, it's for the upper echelon of guys that want something to run against the GT500's of the world.

So being a Camaro Fan how does this not piss you off? Gm building this car for the Upper echelon guys and girls and not the Camaro fans. So Gm in your mind is saying that for the Camaro Fan base we get the Base cars and for the People who want a Vette but want one with a back seat we will offer the Z28 to them.


Going from a V6 to a V8 is about a 10,000 dollar option why going from a V8 to a supercharged V8 not be a 10,000 dollar option either? Ford was able to priceThe 03-04 Cobras between 38-40k and the GT's were in the 25-28k range back in 03/04. Thats about a 10,000 dollar difference.

[Frosty]

The LS1 Camaros were faster then the LS1 Vettes but they were still 20+ grand less in price.

Are you on crack? The fastest bone stock C5 time was 12.6x, done at Atco many years ago, a LS1 Fbody could only dream of that...pound for pound driver for driver a LS1 C5 is faster than a LS1 fbody. Contrary to popular believe not every LS1 Fbody is some magical 12.80 car.

There's a reason a C5 costs more than a Fbody, the built quality is leaps and bounds better than a 4thgen ever could dream of.

[Slow-V6]

So by everyone's opinion here the GT500 is garbage too because it's priced more than a Corvette, right? What's good for the goose is good for the gander, no?

...


The GT500 is garbage because its a Mustang!

Are you on crack? The fastest bone stock C5 time was 12.6x, done at Atco many years ago, a LS1 Fbody could only dream of that...pound for pound driver for driver a LS1 C5 is faster than a LS1 fbody. Contrary to popular believe not every LS1 Fbody is some magical 12.80 car.

There's a reason a C5 costs more than a Fbody, the built quality is leaps and bounds better than a 4thgen ever could dream of.

So every C5 Vette is a 12.6 car?

[Frosty]

So being a Camaro Fan how does this not piss you off? Gm building this car for the Upper echelon guys and girls and not the Camaro fans. So Gm in your mind is saying that for the Camaro Fan base we get the Base cars and for the People who want a Vette but want one with a back seat we will offer the Z28 to them.


Going from a V6 to a V8 is about a 10,000 dollar option why going from a V8 to a supercharged V8 not be a 10,000 dollar option either? Ford was able to priceThe 03-04 Cobras between 38-40k and the GT's were in the 25-28k range back in 03/04. Thats about a 10,000 dollar difference.

Why would it piss me off? Speed costs money, not everything has to be made for our budgets...not everything has to be made for the average guy. I'm sorry but the people whining and complaining about the price are the ones NOT buying one. I'm not taking a shot at anyone's finances because it's none of my business but would you go right out and spend $45K on one tomorrow if it was available?

Quoting prices from 2003 is completely irrelevant, that's 7yrs ago. Also the MT price is speculation. Furthermore the cost of a LSA motor compared to a LS3 is greater than a 3.6-LS3 comparison.

There's a lot of QQ'ing from people that won't even buy one...

For what it's worth you can fully load a SS to hit the 40K mark, so even if it was $50K for a Z28 it still wouldn't be a bad deal and still less than a GT500. :dunno:

So every C5 Vette is a 12.6 car?

Nope, but you said a LS1 fbody is faster than a LS1 C5...and I just blew that ridiculous claim out of the water. "Could" a LS1 beat a C5? Sure..but you take the collective times and the C5 will come out on top...then again I guess owning one and going to the track all the time means nothing lol

I love my Fbodies, always have, always will but I'm not going to be blinded by my loyalty.

The GT500 is garbage because its a Mustang!

Yet ironically more car than yours or mine will ever be. Dude, we get it, you hate Mustangs.

[LTb1ow]

These threads need more pictures and less BS bickering.

Bah.

[Frosty]

These threads need more pictures and less BS bickering.

Bah.

Then post some up :D

[Slow-V6]

Nope, but you said a LS1 fbody is faster than a LS1 C5...and I just blew that ridiculous claim out of the water. "Could" a LS1 beat a C5? Sure..but you take the collective times and the C5 will come out on top...then again I guess owning one and going to the track all the time means nothing lol

Actually I have taken my car the track plenty of times and all of the bolt on C5's I have seen at the track run crappy times compared to the Bolt on LS1 F-bodies. Your experience and my experience is different. You have seen faster C5 Vettes and I have seen faster LS1 F-bodies. Hell my 02 WS6 put down 320 rwhp stock and trapped a 109mph stock. most of the stock C5 vettes I have seen make in the 300 rwhp range. I guess I should have said "In my experience the LS1 Fbody is faster then the C5 vette." I will change that. You can also go to the Corvette museum website and they have the 01 Z06 running a time of 12.6 in the 1/4. How is that possible since the base model C5 runs a 12.6?

Yet ironically more car than yours or mine will ever be. Dude, we get it, you hate Mustangs.

So you dog 4th gen fbodies but love the GT500 mustang?

How can you say a 500hp car weighing in a 4000 plus pounds be more of a car then yours or mine? Man you really hate on F-bodies. Those GT500's are a low 12 high 11 second car at best! I guess its inpossible for a LS1 to get in the 11's right? Are you on crack? I know you drive a 3rd gen but you do realize its pretty comon to get a LS1 F-boby into the 11's right?

[LTb1ow]

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTIgUKZidb4XEBkYqstH-dtRSpxICscH9-mHRb1_rYEOfkTkWI&t=1&usg=__hSF16BxWZviFC-52hZkq4LxsxA4=
http://www.coolcarsinmovies.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/1977-2010-chevy-camaro-front-grille.jpg<--this is certainly not a 77 Z28. It's just a 75-77 Camaro. Carry on.
http://www.instylecars.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/chevrolet-camaro-z28.jpg
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=6598&stc=1&d=1218666206

[sweetbmxrider]

There's a lot of QQ'ing from people that won't even buy one...

BOOM! lets end this party :dancinglock:

[Frosty]

So you dog 4th gen fbodies but love the GT500 mustang?

How can you say a 500hp car weighing in a 4000 plus pounds be more of a car then yours or mine? Man you really hate on F-bodies. Those GT500's are a low 12 high 11 second car at best! I guess its inpossible for a LS1 to get in the 11's right? Are you on crack? I know you drive a 3rd gen but you do realize its pretty comon to get a LS1 F-boby into the 11's right?

How am I dogging a 4thgen? Dude, are you on drugs? I loved my 4thgen just like I love my 3rdgen but I'm not gonna sit there and **** on the GT500 which is a BETTER car than ours...I mean c'mon.

I had solid 12 second Z28 so again, you're really talking out of your ass. What does my 3rdgen have to do with anything? So now suddenly because I currently own a thirdgen I don't know anything about LS1's, dude, my LS1 was faster than your car now :rofl: WTFBBQ

[Slow-V6]

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=6598&stc=1&d=1218666206

Damn that tb is in a weird position.

[Frosty]

Actually I have taken my car the track plenty of times and all of the bolt on C5's I have seen at the track run crappy times compared to the Bolt on LS1 F-bodies. Your experience and my experience is different. You have seen faster C5 Vettes and I have seen faster LS1 F-bodies. Hell my 02 WS6 put down 320 rwhp stock and trapped a 109mph stock. most of the stock C5 vettes I have seen make in the 300 rwhp range. I guess I should have said "In my experience the LS1 Fbody is faster then the C5 vette." I will change that. You can also go to the Corvette museum website and they have the 01 Z06 running a time of 12.6 in the 1/4. How is that possible since the base model C5 runs a 12.6?

Further proof you're seriously clueless. Just stop posting, seriously....just stop(kidding). Go onto the LS1 or C5 boards and see how many stock ZO6's are 11 second cars....hell even Ranger from LS1tech got a 10.9x with just drag radials(unless of course DR's can knock off a second and a half lmao).

As far as the 12'6x from a stock C5...I was there, saw it with my own eyes, it was all over the internet a few years back. I wouldn't make that claim unless it was verified. Oh wait, he did take the fuel rail covers off and put ice on the intake, is that a mod?

So you keep up your brand/generation loyalty, it makes you look really, REALLY silly...and the mere fact that your posted up some museum time is comical...however you DO know the '01 has less HP than a 02-04 right?

[Slow-V6]

How am I dogging a 4thgen? Dude, are you on drugs? I loved my 4thgen just like I love my 3rdgen but I'm not gonna sit there and **** on the GT500 which is a BETTER car than ours...I mean c'mon.

Thats were we differ again. Just because a car is 55,000 dollars doesnt make it better then the car I own. There is a reason I own my T/A and not a GT500 and its not because I cant afford it. I would get a c5 or C6 vette over my car and probably a new Challenger also when I am ready to get a different car. I dont walk up to a GT500 mustang and say man that car is so much better then my car! I might say it is faster but thats about it. I hate the way they look and I hate the way they drive so how can I say the car is better then the car I have already? I love the way that both of my fbodies look, sound , and drive. I dont like the way the mustangs look, or drive. I like the way they sound.

So you keep up your brand/generation loyalty, it makes you look really, REALLY silly...and the mere fact that your posted up some museum time is comical...however you DO know the '01 has less HP than a 02-04 right?

I will keep my loyalty to the F-body. Thats fine. How does that make you look silly on a Fbody website? You might want to head over to the GT500 websites and start praising there cars over there. My WS6 was more expensive to buy new then your GTA so I guess my WS6 is a better car as well?

385hp-405hp
You were also talking about the collective times of a C5 corvette. I read the GM High tech that took the 04 Z06 to a 11.8 in the 1/4. Bad ass car. I believe the 01 Z06 in a very low 12 second car but most of them that I have seen at the track with my own eyes that are stock run in the mid-high 12's.

Just because I dont agree with you why are you so defensive?
60,000 dollar Z28 camaro is going to be the fair price norm, a GT500 mustang is a better car then a F-body, GT500 is in competition with the Corvette.

[Frosty]

I'm not defensive, you're just spreading bad info. You're looking at magazine times, fine...if you want to base your opinion off of that or a few bad drivers at the track thats' your right. The GT500 is NOT in competition with the Corvette, the magazines make that comparison because Ford has no answer for it..that's fine...again, you don't like Mustangs, we get it. You think the GT500 is garbage because it's a Mustang yet it's faster and handles better than your car(and mine). Looks are subjective, I'm not a fan of the looks either but performance #'s don't lie.

It's one thing to be loyal, it's another thing to be blind.


BTW, this is just friendly back and forth, even if you are wrong(lol j/k)

[BigAls87Z28]

What the hell is going on?
The Z28 will not start at 60k. MT has zero clue.

10k price gap? Mustang GT is 30k, GT500 is under 49k. Simple math puts that around 19k over a GT.

None of this makes sense. Chevrolet offering a Camaro for every price, every taste, and several power levels is a stupid idea...but Ford can do it?

[12secondv6]

This thread got stupid.... so I'll make it better

Here is your camaro and mustang killer

http://www.bbbracing.com/12secondv6/Neon/neon3.jpg

[LTb1ow]

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:Mx_mUqCaOmpOvM:http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm165/gallows00/Skittles-791435.jpg&t=1

[Tru2Chevy]

Dear lord.....Slow-V6 and Frosty need to learn how to use Multi-Quote: http://www.njfboa.org/forums/images/buttons/multiquote_off.gif

- Justin

[WildBillyT]

Chevrolet offering a Camaro for every price, every taste, and several power levels is a stupid idea...but Ford can do it?

Bingo

[Slow-V6]

BTW, this is just friendly back and forth, even if you are wrong(lol j/k)


I know. Makes things interesting.

The fact is I havent driven a 05 or newer mustang. I am not a fan of the way they look and I tend to not drive cars that to me dont look good. I still base my impressions on the SN95 and Fox that I have owned. As far as my hatred for mustangs its Kinda like the Mets or Cowboys. I hate those teams. I also hate the way our Hyndai looks but thats my wifes other car so I deal with it.

I am more into just driving my cars now and showing them at car shows and what not. I have crap ton of mods in my dads basement for the 02 T/A that have been down there for 2 yrs now. I just dont have any motivation to install them. My wifes tq converter has been here for almost 2 weeks now. Its just sitting in our dinning room. So for me if a car is faster then mine or handles better I really could care less. 5 years ago I would have cared but now I dont give a ****.


None of this makes sense. Chevrolet offering a Camaro for every price, every taste, and several power levels is a stupid idea...but Ford can do it?

Isnt that what they did with the 4th gens?

V6,Z28,SS,V6,Formula,T/A,WS6 all different prices all different options and all different power levels and still people complained that they were overpriced. There was only a 5k difference for the most part.

When I think of a Camaro I think of a car that was a Cheaper alternative to owning a Vette that had good performance and more interior room. Thats just me.

[BigAls87Z28]

It is cheaper to own a Camaro over a Corvette but it has been a long long time since the Camaro had this type of engine shared with the likes of 65k Caddys and 100k Corvettes.

[sweetbmxrider]

It is cheaper to own a Camaro over a Corvette but it has been a long long time since the Camaro had this type of engine shared with the likes of 65k Caddys and 100k Corvettes.

you could almost say the z28 will be a bargain......but you'd prob just end up on fire. silly flamers :lol:

[Frosty]

The fact is I havent driven a 05 or newer mustang. I am not a fan of the way they look and I tend to not drive cars that to me dont look good. I still base my impressions on the SN95 and Fox that I have owned. As far as my hatred for mustangs its Kinda like the Mets or Cowboys. I hate those teams. I also hate the way our Hyndai looks but thats my wifes other car so I deal with it.



I don't like the way ANY Mustang drives past the Foxbody era, hated the SN95's and even the 05+. I just don't like the feel of them...but that still doesn't take away the performance of the GT500(or even the '11 5.0)

[SteveR]

so what about the ford gt? its a very rare car to see and is marketed to a different person. whats so different with a zr1?

some people have money and just don't give a ****.

I read an article and also talked to some people at Ford years ago and they confirmed that taking traditional profit margins into account, the Ford GT should have been priced in the $80-85k range, but Ford wanted to compete with Ferrari, so they jacked the price up to make it look price wise like it was a super car. Ford profited over $100,000 of each one that sold. The GT was marketed to rich asses with lots of money and no brains. From my understanding, the ZR-1 costs a lot more to build than the GT did and has much better performance numbers. Bang for the buck is definitely with the ZR-1.

Like Al said, this will not be a car that your average 18 year old will take his paper route money to the dealership with and drive out with one. It's for people with money. If it was some gearhead that knew about cars, they'd just buy a base V8 and mod it and it would go faster, and cost less. But the Shelbys, Saleens, Rouchs, and Z28s are not for those people. Hell, the Shelby GT300 is just $2000 in off the shelf parts and with a $20,000 mark up.

[Slow-V6]

I don't like the way ANY Mustang drives past the Foxbody era, hated the SN95's and even the 05+. I just don't like the feel of them...
I loved my 4thgen just like I love my 3rdgen but I'm not gonna sit there and **** on the GT500 which is a BETTER car than ours...I mean c'mon.




So if you dont like the car then how can you say its better then your car or mine?

[Frosty]

So if you dont like the car then how can you say its better then your car or mine?

Liking the way they drive doesn't influence raw performance numbers or what they're capable of. Not liking the way they drive doesn't determine how tight a car is(or isn't).

I'm not ashamed to say a GT500 is a WAY better car than mine.:oops::oops::oops:

I love my GTA, it's a relatively clean car, especially for the year and for the fact it's been a PA/NJ it's entire life, it's relatively quick for being a bone stock L98 w/valve seals that are more beat than a $5 whore(screw you GM for using ****** seals in that era lol)....it's a good car but to compare it to a GT500 or any car comparable to it would be an insult to said cars.

[Slow-V6]

Liking the way they drive doesn't influence raw performance numbers. Not liking the way they drive doesn't determine how tight a car is(or isn't).

I'm not ashamed to say a GT500 is a WAY better car than mine.:oops::oops::oops:

I love my GTA, it's a relatively clean car, especially for the year and the fact it's been a PA/NJ it's entire life, it's relatively quick....it's a good car but to compare it to a GT500 or any car comparable to it would be an insult to said cars.


So you would buy a car because it is fast even though you hate the way it drives ,Looks and feels?

Just because a car costs 60,000 and makes more power then my car doesnt make it a better car then the one I own! For me liking the way a car looks and drives is a big part of me either buying the car or not. The New camaro is a good example. I like the way the car drives and handles but am not to fond of the way it looks. It hadles better then my T/A and is just as fast as my T/A but to me doesnt look as good as my T/A so I dont think the car is a better car then the one I already have. Because of this I will not get a 24,000 Camaro or a 60,000 Camaro.

I bought my SN95 body Mustang because I liked the way it looked and sounded but didnt really like the way it drove or felt while driving. I had a 88 GTA at the time as well and even though this Mustang cost thousands of dollars more then my GTA I felt my GTA was a better car and sold my Mustang.

[Frosty]

So you would buy a car because it is fast even though you hate the way it drives ,Looks and feels?



Why are you constantly putting words in my mouth? I said nothing about buying any car or buying a car I didn't like.

So lets flip it, I drove and drove in a Ford GT years ago, wasn't my cup of tea, especially for $200K....does that mean my GTA is a "better" car? Of course not. I personally would never buy a Toyota product but does that mean my '96 Thunderbird is a better car than an Avalon? Absolutely not.

What "I" like better for "me" doesn't mean overall my choice is a better car generally speaking.

I guess I can look at things objectively and as non-biased as possible.

Another example, everyone has a hard-on for cars like the Lotus Esprit....I personally think they look like a bag of smashed ********....does that mean my GTA is a better car?

I think we're gonna agree to disagree on this topic :rofl:

[maroman88]

Why are you constantly putting words in my mouth? I said nothing about buying any car or buying a car I didn't like.

So lets flip it, I drove and drove in a Ford GT years ago, wasn't my cup of tea, especially for $200K....does that mean my GTA is a "better" car? Of course not. I personally would never buy a Toyota product but does that mean my '96 Thunderbird is a better car than an Avalon? Absolutely not.

What "I" like better for "me" doesn't mean overall my choice is a better car generally speaking.

I guess I can look at things objectively and as non-biased as possible.

Another example, everyone has a hard-on for cars like the Lotus Esprit....I personally think they look like a bag of smashed ********....does that mean my GTA is a better car?

I think we're gonna agree to disagree on this topic :rofl:

dude GTA's are the ****tttttt... for their time they were fast annnnd luxurious, and add the turbo 6 to a GTA and u had the fastest car of the time

[Slow-V6]

What "I" like better for "me" doesn't mean overall my choice is a better car generally speaking.


Then dont put my car in with your obsession with the GT500. Just because you think the GT500 is a better car then yours and mine doesnt mean I do.

I have the car I always wanted since I started to realize what a car was. There are very few cars in the world that I think are better cars then mine and would like to have over my car. You might think thats stupid or what not. I dont care.

dude GTA's are the ****tttttt... for their time they were fast annnnd luxurious, and add the turbo 6 to a GTA and u had the fastest car of the time

Agree with you 100% GTA were and still are very bad ass cars.

[Frosty]

Then dont put my car in with your obsession with the GT500. Just because you think the GT500 is a better car then yours and mine doesnt mean I do.

I have the car I always wanted since I started to realize what a car was. There are very few cars in the world that I think are better cars then mine and would like to have over my car. You might think thats stupid or what not. I dont care.

My obsession? :confused: Dude where are you pulling that stuff from? The GT500 is/was part of the discussion, it was brought up since it will be the Z28's competition.

I'm not obsessed with the car by any means, I personally would never buy one but it's part of the discussion...not sure what is so hard to understand.

It's great you love your car, I love mine. We'll agree to disagree...no biggie. I'm not biased and I'm not afraid to admit when my car is outmatched, it won't hurt my ego ;)

[Z28 Heritage]

Damn i wish i can read all of this thread but i got a interview at WAWA!!!!8-) So i have to go start getting ready.


IMO The challenger looks 10x better then both the Camaro and Mustang. I remember my fathers 1996 V6 Camaro that thing sucked more balls then his Trailblazer. Never get a V6 sports car its like driving a civic lol.:rofl:

[BonzoHansen]

Like Al said, this will not be a car that your average 18 year old will take his paper route money to the dealership with and drive out with one. It's for people with money. If it was some gearhead that knew about cars, they'd just buy a base V8 and mod it and it would go faster, and cost less. But the Shelbys, Saleens, Rouchs, and Z28s are not for those people. Hell, the Shelby GT300 is just $2000 in off the shelf parts and with a $20,000 mark up.

All this. Top shelf cars have never been cheap. 1969 Camaro ZL1s did not sell because they doubled the price of the car. Just for an engine. Yenkos were not cheap.

Plus with the new CAFE standards they probably want to limit production so the hit is not as bad. So make less, sell for more.

[Frosty]

Damn i wish i can read all of this thread but i got a interview at WAWA!!!!8-) So i have to go start getting ready.



Sweet! Good luck.

[BigAls87Z28]

Damn i wish i can read all of this thread but i got a interview at WAWA!!!!8-) So i have to go start getting ready.


IMO The challenger looks 10x better then both the Camaro and Mustang. I remember my fathers 1996 V6 Camaro that thing sucked more balls then his Trailblazer. Never get a V6 sports car its like driving a civic lol.:rofl:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_nqVlojKKcrU/SwdkDHKyG7I/AAAAAAAAAMw/WRsUA_O8pyg/s1600/porsche911turbo26210245kq.jpg


Yeah...youre right....

[Frosty]

lol :owned:

[Z28 Heritage]

Yeah...youre right....Yea that thing looks like a bug that needs to be killed. I hate them more then Civics:-x

[Z28 Heritage]

Sweet! Good luck.Yea it went well i hope i get it:shock:

[Slow-V6]

I remember my fathers 1996 V6 Camaro that thing sucked more balls then his Trailblazer. Never get a V6 sports car its like driving a civic lol.:rofl:

Wish I still had my Slow as **** V6 Firebird.

I dont know about you but a GN and TTA are pretty fast cars for what they were. The New V6 Camaro's and Mustangs are pretty fast also.

. I'm not biased and I'm not afraid to admit when my car is outmatched, it won't hurt my ego ;)

If the only thing I care about is how much power my car has compared to another car then I would agree with you but for me hp/tq are just a part of wether I like a car or dont. Yes the GT500 is faster then my T/A so in that aspect it does outmatch my car. I think my T/A is a much better looking car and is to me a much more fun car to drive so my car outmatches the GT500 in those 2 areas in my opinion. I have never driven a 05+ Mustang but have rode in a couple and it still has that Ford Taurus feel to it.


My obsession? :confused: Dude where are you pulling that stuff from? The GT500 is/was part of the discussion;)

But you are the only one saying that it is a better car then yours or mine. My whole point is that if you hate the way the car looks and drives and never plan on buying one then how is it better then your car? I guess it comes down to 1 question. Would you rather have your GTA or the GT500 if someone gave you the option? If someone offered me a C5 Z06 or my WS6 I would take the Z06 because to me the Z06 is a better car then mine.

[Frosty]

If the only thing I care about is how much power my car has compared to another car then I would agree with you but for me hp/tq are just a part of wether I like a car or dont. Yes the GT500 is faster then my T/A so in that aspect it does outmatch my car. I think my T/A is a much better looking car and is to me a much more fun car to drive so my car outmatches the GT500 in those 2 areas in my opinion. I have never driven a 05+ Mustang but have rode in a couple and it still has that Ford Taurus feel to it.


But you are the only one saying that it is a better car then yours or mine. My whole point is that if you hate the way the car looks and drives and never plan on buying one then how is it better then your car? I guess it comes down to 1 question. Would you rather have your GTA or the GT500 if someone gave you the option? If someone offered me a C5 Z06 or my WS6 I would take the Z06 because to me the Z06 is a better car then mine.

So because I think the car is better than ours I'm obsessed with it? Dude you're grasping at straws. It seems like, with you, that if you're not sucking GM's dick about the Fbody then you're a hater. I'm an automotive enthusiast that happens to love Fbodies.

To answer your question....would I take a GT500 over my GTA? Hmmmm....the way it sits now? Abso-****in-lutely. The GTA is a high 12 second car...meh....it's quick but still needs work. I'd rock the GT500 for a while(it's faster, handles better). I'd learn to get used to the way it drives. I'd then sell it and finish the GTA the way I plan on(which will give a GT500 a run for its $$$$).

So yes, a faster car that handles better that has a warranty(and that is worth $55K) compared to a great looking car that is slower and needs work. It's a no brainer.

Like I said, to each their own and we'll agree to disagree...it's just funny that I'm being called a hater and being obsessed with the car considering I've owned the same amount or 1 more Fbody than you have. ;) Just a bit of irony. ;)

BTW we're just gonna keep going back and forth on this so lets just nip it now lol I'll agree to disagree.

[BonzoHansen]

So because I think the car is better than ours I'm obsessed with it? .

I know the truth. You're obsessed with Josh. In a man-love-probably-not-but-maybe-in-a-gay way. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v359/SIBLY/Emos/NTTIAWWT.png

[Frosty]

It's true......I can't help it. :rofl::D

The man-date's we go on every Thursday are just awesome...but alas....we could never be.

OK, I have to stop or else people might start thinking the wrong thing :rofl:

[Z28 Heritage]

Okay you got me on the GN thats the only nice V6 Muscle Sport Car.

[SteveR]

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_nqVlojKKcrU/SwdkDHKyG7I/AAAAAAAAAMw/WRsUA_O8pyg/s1600/porsche911turbo26210245kq.jpg


Yeah...youre right....

technically Porsches are flat 6s, not V6s

[BonzoHansen]

Okay you got me on the GN thats the only nice V6 Muscle Sport Car.

89 turbo trans am?

http://image.highperformancepontiac.com/f/8789036/0610_hppp_01z+1989_pontiac_trans_am+full.jpg

[Z28 Heritage]

Yea so what does that make Two Nice V6 cars don't show me Imports. I mean Real cars not little toys.:twisted:


By the way I would love a GTA in Black. They look so good:drool:

[SteveR]

1.21 GIGWATTS!!!

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Wnyjd_He-xQ/Rm4KDl6dq7I/AAAAAAAAAIo/gxMHwFt08vQ/s400/1985_delorean_b.jpg
http://www.automopedia.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/doc-brown-bttf.jpg

[Slow-V6]

89 turbo trans am?

http://image.highperformancepontiac.com/f/8789036/0610_hppp_01z+1989_pontiac_trans_am+full.jpg


Now that thing is sexy. I love the white GTA t/a body style. Would definatly rock a 3rd gen GTA over a GT500. Miss my 88 GTA very much. Damn Iraq war.

it's just funny that I'm being called a hater and being obsessed with the car considering I've owned the same amount or 1 more Fbody than you have. ;) Just a bit of irony. ;)
.

I have owned 10 Fbodies, 2 mustangs, 3 Shelby Dodge daytonas, 1 300zx, and a couple other daily driver type cars. I have owned 5 3rd gens ,4 4th gens, and a 2nd gen.

. I'm an automotive enthusiast that happens to love Fbodies.

. Good for you. I am an automotive enthusiast that loves Fbodies as well and every other car that I think is cool I give it a try ( depending on price of course) and if I like it I will keep it as well or will always look out for one to buy. Thats why I have owned other sports cars. If I am on GM nuts like you say then why would I own a Mustang, or Daytona, or even a Nissan sports car? I liked the mustang untill I owned 2 of them and learned to hate them, I still love the old shelby daytonas, I always loved the looks of the 90's 300zx untill I owned one and learned to hate it as well.

[Frosty]

K...you win. I love the GT500, I want to have sex with it...I hate GM, I hate Fbodies, I hate my GTA.

[LTb1ow]

Thank god.

[Frosty]

Thank god.

No one forces you to click on these threads....spanky. :D

[LTb1ow]

Gotta read em all!

[Frosty]

Then STFU :rofl:

[LTb1ow]

Wanna agrue in circles for another 5 pages about this?

:lol:

[Frosty]

Yes!

Starting


NOW!

[Slow-V6]

I am in!!