Do you think any if the 4th gen. F bodies will ever become big dollar collectables?

[Mezzy]

I want your opinion on weather or not you think any of the 4th generation F bodies will ever become big dollar collectables. Cars such as the Standard Z28s or the Trans Ams, or the special editions like the 1LE Z28, or the very limited N.H.R.A. Edition Formulas or Trans Ams? What about the Firehawk? Or the C.E.T.A. Trans Ams? What about all the different anniversary editions Chevy and Pontiac put out every 5 years? Will a manual transmission be worth more than an automatic? Will T tops add a lot more value? I think being that they were the first muscle cars to have real horsepower numbers, since the original muscle car era, if kept in beautiful condition, most will become big dollar collectables, except that it will take awhile, being so many were made. What do you think? I'd like to know?

[Mike]

Doubtful. Maybe the gmmg and dick Harrell type cars. But they ran off way too many fourth gens for real value

[WSex]

one day they will be worth 50,000+ not because of rarity but due to inflation. lol

[Mike]

one day they will be worth 50,000+ not because of rarity but due to inflation. lol

Wrong. As the cost of living goes up, the values of expendable items ie. hobby type cars and spending will go down.

Look at the values of 1st gens and other classics at auction say 8 years ago compared to now.

[Mezzy]

But they made a boatload of the 68-72s no? I mean, you can still find those old cars to restore. Eventually, won't all the 4th gen cars fade away from rot, crashes, junk yards, etc, and suffer the same fate as their predecessors? Then in time won't they be in demand like the original muscle cars? The only reason I see them maybe not rising in vale would be because unlike after the muscle car era,where you couldn't buy a hp car, because they weren't making them anymore, today, you can buy new cars with high hp, so the desire for a 4th gen., might not be as much as anticipated.

[sweetbmxrider]

Yeah and we will be swapping battery packs and electric motors into them :lol:

[grazi]

I think I agree with Mike on this one. I don't think any 80's or 90's muscle cars are ever going to be worth big money like the 60's eras cars. Aside from 87 GNX's and Grand Nationals what other vehicle has risen or held value 20 years later? Roush and Saleen Mustangs? 89 Turbo Trans Am? Zr1? That's all I can think of.

[WildBillyT]

Some of them might. As stated, like the GMMG, Harrell, and 1LE cars.

The three biggest factors that I can see are these:

1.) The collector car universe is huge now. Way back when the musclecar era was killed by smog and insurance so nobody gave a crap about a lot of the stuff that's high $ now. It was sent to the crusher as an old car. Plus rustproofing was poor. Everybody NOW knows that if you hang on to a car somebody may want it later. Then? Not so much.

2.) There are not very many options that made these cars unique from each other. Colors and transmission choice, really. And the WS6/Firehawk/SS package, but even then they're all the same other than trans and colors. The RPO choices from, say, 1969 are as long as your arm. There were 14 engine choices and something like 7 transmission choices. Fiber optic lamp monitoring. Standard and heavy duty clutches. Brake upgrades. Steering upgrades. And so forth.

3.) New stuff is better in almost every conceivable way. The 5th gen will hurt the 4th gen's values down the line. Just like the 4th keeps the 3rd down. 1st and 2nd are a class their own since 67-72 has its own cultural significance.

The stuff that's worth high $ now is because it's unique, rare, and is either pleasing to (most) eyes or performance oriented. Rare does not necessarily mean valuable.

[Mezzy]

Grazi, I'm not asking about 80s cars. We all know theyll never be worth anything. I follow what wild bill is saying about the 4th gens.

[BonzoHansen]

They will never reach the same levels as older muscle cars. So that is not the question to answer.

The viable question is will they at some point appreciate in value and be considered collectible. To that I will say yes, to some degree, they will. But it will only be the ‘good ones’. SS cars, etc., like WBT said. The past few years have seen the 3rd gens continue to rise in value, but it has to be a good one, of course. A Z28 is always worth more than a 6cyl car, be it a 1967 or a 2002. The lower the mileage, the better. Modifications very often decrease value (even with used cars). Ones that can be undone easily are better. But there are always exceptions to the modification rule and ‘acceptable’ mods go in & out of style. See pro-street. There is a reason you are seeing pro-street cars get new wheels and then marketed as pro-touring. PT is hot now, PS is not. I think a lot of guys are buying cars they can drive. PS cars are not good drivers. A well built PT car is great to drive. The dumb buyer will see 18” wheels and disc brakes and think they have a PT car, but what they really have is a poor street drive train, a craptastic street suspension and poorly sorted drag brakes. Right now a well built PT 69 Camaro will bring 2-3x the value of the same car if it is a clean, OE restored base car. But it won’t bring a real 69 Z28 that much higher, if at all. In 5 years? Who knows.

4th gens will continue their current slide down used car prices and then at some point you’ll see the cream of the crop start to go up again. That is just how it works with this kind of car. Yes the 5th gens will hurt resale value now. But the resurgence of the Camaro name will help in the long run.

What I do wonder is will the level of collectability/demand will be inverse to level of technology. The more complicated (computers, etc) cars become, does the hurt future interest? Part availability, increased repair/restore difficulty, etc.

I wonder how the demise of Pontiac impacts long term Firebird values.

[BonzoHansen]

Grazi, I'm not asking about 80s cars. We all know theyll never be worth anything. I follow what wild bill is saying about the 4th gens.wrong. if 3rd gens don't go up in value. neither will 4th gens. Of course the market is showing good 3rd gens are appreciating in value.

[Mezzy]

I'm only asking about 4th gens cause I own a bunch and I love em. Just like to year what people think. Bill makes some sense. but only time will tell

[WildBillyT]

I'm only asking about 4th gens cause I own a bunch and I love em. Just like to year what people think. Bill makes some sense. but only time will tell

Your NHRA edition if it's in good shape and not too molested. The other two are not going anywhere price wise.

JMO. And for what it's worth, I'm the type of guy who keeps an eye on values, has a "portfolio", and watches the blue chip cars as this type of thing is interesting to me.

[WildBillyT]

What I do wonder is will the level of collectability/demand will be inverse to level of technology. The more complicated (computers, etc) cars become, does the hurt future interest? Part availability, increased repair/restore difficulty, etc.



This is a huge point. Part of the reason the old stuff is popular and valuable is because you can work on it at home with hand tools...

:nick:

[1320B4U]

3rd gens are rising in value just like the dime a dozen monte carlo ss's. Why?...b/c most people back then realized the production #'s and just drove them into the ground thinking there would be no value to them. Take for instance the gn's...i would guess approx 75% of them are lower mileaged, garaged kept vehicles as they didn't make a ton of them compared to the regal's so everyone kept them decent. Of the 200k monte carlo ss's built a lot more were used everyday and a lot more were crushed. NOt to say an ss' monte is worth more than a gn but collectibility is the amt of nice, low mileage vehicles avail to a consumer. You can't say an 80's camaro isn't worth anything but a 4th gen camaro will be...thats just stupid as they are pretty much the same type of vehicle. Its like saying a 327/powerglide camaro from '69 isn't worth anything b/c its not an original dz302/m22 higher hp car. Will they every attain the older muscle car values, NO!...but there will be a market for collectible 80's AND 90s and beyond vehicles if the condition, mileage, and options are there to warrant it. Answer to your question is yes, there will be value on certain 4th gens....low mileage ss's and ws6's (moderate value) to higher end values on lt-4 ss anniversary's, collector/anniversary edition birds, nickey camaro's, intimidators, etc. Low production #'s too help.

You have to remember the collectible people to yours and my car are the people who want to relive their youth in 20 years or the folks not even born yet that want a nostaglic vehicle down the line.

[BonzoHansen]

You have to remember the collectible people to yours and my car are the people who want to relive their youth in 20 years or the folks not even born yet that want a nostaglic vehicle down the line.
Yes, timing! one of the reasons for g-body and 3rd gen price appreciation is the kid that wanted them new but could not afford one are now adults with income. it's part of the cycle!

[WayFast84]

Who cares? Don't buy a car as an investment. It won't ever work out the way you plan on it. Are you gonna park a car and let it sit for 40 years? Restore one later? Just ask Jl8Jeff about his 1st gen restoration.

[WildBillyT]

3rd gens are rising in value just like the dime a dozen monte carlo ss's. Why?...b/c most people back then realized the production #'s and just drove them into the ground thinking there would be no value to them. Take for instance the gn's...i would guess approx 75% of them are lower mileaged, garaged kept vehicles as they didn't make a ton of them compared to the regal's so everyone kept them decent. Of the 200k monte carlo ss's built a lot more were used everyday and a lot more were crushed. NOt to say an ss' monte is worth more than a gn but collectibility is the amt of nice, low mileage vehicles avail to a consumer. You can't say an 80's camaro isn't worth anything but a 4th gen camaro will be...thats just stupid as they are pretty much the same type of vehicle. Its like saying a 327/powerglide camaro from '69 isn't worth anything b/c its not an original dz302/m22 higher hp car. Will they every attain the older muscle car values, NO!...but there will be a market for collectible 80's AND 90s and beyond vehicles if the condition, mileage, and options are there to warrant it. Answer to your question is yes, there will be value on certain 4th gens....low mileage ss's and ws6's (moderate value) to higher end values on lt-4 ss anniversary's, collector/anniversary edition birds, nickey camaro's, intimidators, etc. Low production #'s too help.

You have to remember the collectible people to yours and my car are the people who want to relive their youth in 20 years or the folks not even born yet that want a nostaglic vehicle down the line.

Yes, timing! one of the reasons for g-body and 3rd gen price appreciation is the kid that wanted them new but could not afford one are now adults with income. it's part of the cycle!

The original question was "big money". There will always be a market to reclaim one's youth.


Who cares? Don't buy a car as an investment. It won't ever work out the way you plan on it. Are you gonna park a car and let it sit for 40 years? Restore one later? Just ask Jl8Jeff about his 1st gen restoration.

And keep in mind, "restoration" is exactly that. No engine upgrades, no trans swap, etc. And you have to keep some of the things that suck. Like points and a Q-Jet.

[BonzoHansen]

Correct. Big money? No. Appreciating prices? Yes.


And Q-Jets are good carbs! LOL

[WayFast84]

LG4 for life.

[LTb1ow]

Why would a plastic car with glass rear ends and transmissions be worth anything?

[sweetbmxrider]

Why would a plastic car with glass rear ends and transmissions be worth anything?

Lots of people collect glass!

[WildBillyT]

Correct. Big money? No. Appreciating prices? Yes.


And Q-Jets are good carbs! LOL

Yeah, mine keeps the shop door from blowing closed really well!

[Jersey Mike]

ever become big dollar collectables.

No.

[Mike]

Interesting tidbit. There were more 67-69 camaros built than 1993-2002 camaros built

[The_Bishop]

The real issue is how many of them survived the intervening years.

[Dudbird113]

From what some of my parents friends say 60s muscle cars werent worth anything in the 70s and early 80s. My coworker said he owned like 6 muscle cars when he in his 20s, which he said he paid like 400 for. Like 8 years ago a 3rd gen was worth dirt, but there slowly climbing up in price as the years pass. Id give it time and 4th gens will be worth some money. Just not as much as a lets say a real 69 chevelle ss.

[jam01]

while none of you guys know me personally, i figured i would give you my opinion. i am 47 and i have owned a lot of chevelles camaros trucks and some other gm cars and 1 ford bronco roughly 80 something vehicles, all registered insured and driven. anyway when i first got my license early 80's, 60's cars where plentiful and cheap and i was lucky to have a few. my first car was a 69 chevelle i paid $400. for it, unfortunately it did not last long enough for me to really enjoy. while i would pay almost anything to have that car back or one like it. moral of the story is if you love a certain car and have the funds to buy, i think most would. so yes our 4th gens will appreciate in coming years.

[1320B4U]

I remember '69 conv camaros going for 12k all day long. My parents almost bought a '68 rs for 7k back in the late 80's that was real nice. Car would've been a 20k now.

[Mezzy]

When the 4th gens are all gone, the few that are left will be worth more than 80s cars because the 80s weren't performance years. Noone knew how to make performance while meeting the new emission standards of the day. 4th gens began to do both. Who wants to collect a v8 rs or formula with a mere 170 hp, Lmao

[Mezzy]

I personally think 4th gens will wind up collecting more money than the older ones some day. But I also love to dream. I'm holding on to mine. That much I know today.

[BonzoHansen]

I personally think 4th gens will wind up collecting more money than the older ones some day. But I also love to dream. I'm holding on to mine. That much I know today.

You can wish all day, ain't gonna happen

[Mezzy]

That's what we thought about most the high dollar cars today that weren't worth a hill of beans 10 years after they were made. I say history eventually repeats itself. My money is on they will be worth what todays collectables are worth.

[Mezzy]

They do everything better than any stock 1 st gen so why wouldn't they go up in value once they become "rare"?

[BonzoHansen]

That's what we thought about most the high dollar cars today that weren't worth a hill of beans 10 years after they were made. I say history eventually repeats itself. My money is on they will be worth what todays collectables are worth.

Ha ha ha. Let me know when a stock 4th gen Z28 matches the prices of a 1st gen Z28 in comparable shape. I'll give you $100.

[Mezzy]

If we learn anything from history, its that it always repeats itself no?

[Jersey Mike]

You're pretty adamant about this, so I'll bite:


1) How much do you consider "Big Dollar" -- let's get a concrete price range.
2) By what year will they reach this "Big Dollar" price?


When the 4th gens are all gone, the few that are left will be worth more than 80s cars because the 80s weren't performance years. Noone knew how to make performance while meeting the new emission standards of the day. 4th gens began to do both. Who wants to collect a v8 rs or formula with a mere 170 hp, Lmao

I personally think 4th gens will wind up collecting more money than the older ones some day. But I also love to dream. I'm holding on to mine. That much I know today.

That's what we thought about most the high dollar cars today that weren't worth a hill of beans 10 years after they were made. I say history eventually repeats itself. My money is on they will be worth what todays collectables are worth.

They do everything better than any stock 1 st gen so why wouldn't they go up in value once they become "rare"?

[Mezzy]

I'm thinking once the car is 30 yrs old, we'll see the values rival the 1st gens all day. But remember, I'm an optimist.

[BonzoHansen]

I'm thinking once the car is 30 yrs old, we'll see the values rival the 1st gens all day. But remember, I'm an optimist.

so are you assuming 1st and 2nd gens will not only stop appreciating in price, but will actually depreciate? Or is your hypothesis that the pricing of 4th gen Camaros defy all logic and quadruple in value in the next 10 years?

By your logic a good fox body mustang should be worth more than a 67 fastback. News flash, it’s not.

[Jersey Mike]

I'm thinking once the car is 30 yrs old, we'll see the values rival the 1st gens all day. But remember, I'm an optimist.

Give me a dollar number, please.




So by 2023, for LT1s and by 2028 for LS1s, if I followed you correctly?

[WildBillyT]

They will never gain in value the way the 1st and early 2nd gen cars did.

That would mean a 4th gen SS would be worth over half a million dollars in 25 years.

Oh, and another thing to the "reclaim your youth" argument. A lot of kids today lust after 60's iron just like their dads did. Even on here. There are a lot of guys that would dump their 4th gen for a nice '69 Camaro. Therefore that will affect demand down the line.

[Mezzy]

Well not that much, but I figured they be worth what they were new at least. What do u think ?

[WildBillyT]

Gun to my head, a VERY nice unmolested original will be worth a bit more than new.

But the market will be flooded with all kinds of performance collector cars, and it wasn't near that way back in the 90's-early '00s. So regular stuff may stall in the teens.

[BonzoHansen]

Well not that much, but I figured they be worth what they were new at least. What do u think ?

:facepalm:

[Mezzy]

I didn't know these cars weren't really popular when new. Young guys like me, saw them new and thought they were just awesome. All my peers were sweating to have a fast modern muscle car. I don't get why on hear, some say they weren't desirable

[Blackbirdws6]

I believe only the rarest and desirable combinations (read: special editions that added considerable modifications) will be worth something later on. Unmolested SS and WS6 cars will hold some value but I don't believe they will hit the level of the original muscle cars. If I have money for only a few cars, I am more likely to spend my cash on a well built vehicle that can do everything better than a stocker as opposed to an all original, low mile car. I like all original cars but owning one doesn't interest me.

[Mezzy]

I've owned mid and late model 2nd and 3rd gens when that was all their was, and a 4th gen is much more enjoyable to me.

[BonzoHansen]

Gun to my head, a VERY nice unmolested original will be worth a bit more than new.

But the market will be flooded with all kinds of performance collector cars, and it wasn't near that way back in the 90's-early '00s. So regular stuff may stall in the teens.

Yup. Guys buy new ones today hoping they appreciate. My neighbor swore the 2003 Mach I he bought would jump in value. Nope. He sold it at a loss. Just look at all the low mileage 78 pace cars out there. Too many.

I've owned mid and late model 2nd and 3rd gens when that was all their was, and a 4th gen is much more enjoyable to me.

that matters not. you obviously don't get it.

I believe only the rarest and desirable combinations (read: special editions that added considerable modifications) will be worth something later on. Unmolested SS and WS6 cars will hold some value but I don't believe they will hit the level of the original muscle cars. If I have money for only a few cars, I am more likely to spend my cash on a well built vehicle that can do everything better than a stocker as opposed to an all original, low mile car. I like all original cars but owning one doesn't interest me.

+1000000000

[Jersey Mike]

Give me a dollar number, please.




So by 2023, for LT1s and by 2028 for LS1s, if I followed you correctly?

Well not that much, but I figured they be worth what they were new at least. What do u think ?


So $30,000 for a great condition WS6 will be the norm by 2028? ...Am I understanding this right?

[WildBillyT]

I didn't know these cars weren't really popular when new. Young guys like me, saw them new and thought they were just awesome. All my peers were sweating to have a fast modern muscle car. I don't get why on hear, some say they weren't desirable

For what it's worth, they sold more Camaros in just 1979 than they did the entire run of LS1 years. By 50,000 cars. Don't take that as "Well, 4th gens will be rare then". Take that as "nobody was really that excited."

[Mezzy]

Maybe I don't get it. Maybe someone can explain it to me. I've been told I'm slow. And I'm only hoping about the numbers I mention. I'm not claiming to think I know anything. It's all speculation. I'm not old enough to see the fascination with the non performance years.

[BonzoHansen]

Maybe I don't get it. Maybe someone can explain it to me. I've been told I'm slow. And I'm only hoping about the numbers I mention. I'm not claiming to think I know anything. It's all speculation. I'm not old enough to see the fascination with the non performance years.

What is the best guitar made today?

[Mezzy]

That's what I'm saying their, Mikey,lol

[Mezzy]

Best guitar is a matter of opinion. Is that ur point lol?

[Mezzy]

I just enjoy hearing what guys say about those older cars because I missed the boat on getting my hands on one. When I started driving it was 1990. 60s cars were just a bit outta my reach. Now they're for the rich.

[Blackbirdws6]

Maybe you can rephrase your last statement as I don't quite understand what you are trying to say.

[WildBillyT]

Maybe I don't get it. Maybe someone can explain it to me. I've been told I'm slow. And I'm only hoping about the numbers I mention. I'm not claiming to think I know anything. It's all speculation. I'm not old enough to see the fascination with the non performance years.

It can be pretty complex.

You are not THAT far off base with the comment in red.

74-84 stuff of any make and model (with exceptions) is not pulling great numbers due to styling sometimes being a bit funky and factory performance being not so great.

But it's older, and easy to work on. So all of the sudden that 185hp Camaro can be a 450hp Camaro in a weekend for not that much money. Probably less than the price of a rear in a 4th gen.

[BonzoHansen]

Best guitar is a matter of opinion. Is that ur point lol?

Opinion? Yes, that matters! Which is why a bubbletop impala will always be worth more than a 96 impala even if the 96 impala is better car in all aspects.


Trying hard to make you understand. Why is a 59 Les Paul worth so much? There are lots of nice guitars ‘mass market’ made today, ones that probably play better. Because it was beautiful and they don’t make them anymore. It has an allure. Like a 69 Camaro. (like cars, you can’t compare to a custom builds, those are a very different market).

[Mezzy]

Ok, now I see ur point. I understand that.

[Mezzy]

Thanks, bill, bonzo and mike. I'm alittle young to kno what you all know, but I'm willing to learn it from you guys who obviously kno. I guess in short, I hope to someday have my own 69 camaro, or chevelle or gto or a grand sport. I'd take any late 60s muscle car I could afford to get my hands on. You guys are are very very lucky if you were able to witness what I unfortunately missed out on.

[WildBillyT]

No problem. Some of us missed the boat too :D

[Jersey Mike]

Speak for yourself, whippersnapper.

[BonzoHansen]

For the record you are older than Mike & WBT. And I'm only 2 years older than you. At least according to your profile. :p

[Mezzy]

Huh, interesting. So then you guys grew up around new Irocs as a kid like me, lol . At that time, the only cars I liked were the GN, Iroc, Monte SS, and the trans am. You? I mean other than wishing I had a 60s car

[Mezzy]

I hated that imitation 442 gutless lol

[JSPERFORMANCE]

It's a shame third gens are so underpowered and ugly... I guess I should scrap mine and go buy a catfish..

[Mezzy]

I love the 3d gens. They were all new cars when I was a teen. Those are the cars I remember new as an impressionable kid. I loved em big time, till I saw the beastly 4th gens. Now that's my love. But ill never stop trying to save up for a 69 maro or chevelle

[Mezzy]

I remember my dad going to Salerno Pontiac in randolph, in 1987 looking to buy a friggin station wagon which he did,Lmao, and all I kept doing was begging him to cosign for a GTA lol

[BonzoHansen]

Huh, interesting. So then you guys grew up around new Irocs as a kid like me, lol . At that time, the only cars I liked were the GN, Iroc, Monte SS, and the trans am. You? I mean other than wishing I had a 60s car
Yup. IROCs were new when I was in high school. My first car was a 76 Camaro LT. 11 year old used car. It got wrecked by a jerk who felt people making a left have the right of way. Then I bought an 82 TA. 6 year old car. I liked that car. Sold it when I was house hunting. Bu tI like 1st & 2nd gens better, aesthetically. I can make a car fast. I’m not a pure stock guy. I like drivers.

It's a shame third gens are so underpowered and ugly... I guess I should scrap mine and go buy a catfish..True. Tell you what, I’ll give you $1000 for the red piece of junk.

[WildBillyT]

But ill never stop trying to save up for a 69 maro or chevelle

Keep the NHRA car, dump the other two, add a little $ and buy a '69 that's not a total mess. You could probably get into a decent starter '69 for 10-12k.

[Mezzy]

First time I saw an Iroc was the summer of 1985, and I was on vacation in lavalette, and I wad 12, and a yellow Iroc came down the strip. That's it!!! I was hooked on them for years. My dad bought a 92 25th RS, and finally sold it a few years ago, to buy a 68 Plymouth GTX. I shouldve kept that car. He was willing to give it to me, but I wanted another 4th gen car. I should kept it, just cause it was my dads.

[Mezzy]

Probably right bill. But I have a bad habit of holding on to the cars I already have. My collection was getting outta control, lol. I want to add a 69 without depleting my heard. Itll happen soon enough. I have no kids, and I don't have a mortgage. Hopefully, soon.

[WildBillyT]

First time I saw an Iroc was the summer of 1985, and I was on vacation in lavalette, and I wad 12, and a yellow Iroc came down the strip. That's it!!! I was hooked on them for years. My dad bought a 92 25th RS, and finally sold it a few years ago, to buy a 68 Plymouth GTX. I shouldve kept that car. He was willing to give it to me, but I wanted another 4th gen car. I should kept it, just cause it was my dads.

Wow, really? You passed on a 440 Mopar to get a 4th gen car? Was the GTX beat up?

Even a slightly beat driver GTX is worth $25K+

[Mezzy]

I was in high school from 87-91. All my friends had mid 70s camaros. Fun times, but I remember the.king how long it took to get them up over 120 mph.lol

[Mezzy]

No didn't pass it up. My dad bought the GTX ,then sold the camaro. he bought a 67 GTX new, and kicked himself for selling it. So when he bought a 340 dart new, had me, then sold that one, I had to question his priorities, lol so a few years ago, after he saw me collecting my cars, he decided it was time to get back into the game. Someday, that original 440 car will be mine.

[WildBillyT]

Oh, my bad. I misread that and thought he sold the GTX.

[Mezzy]

I can't believe how much rumbling power that 440 makes with basically only a mild cam. Don't even got headers and its crazy!

[JSPERFORMANCE]

Dont know if i would call a high 13 second car "Beastly"......

[Mezzy]

I was really talking about the overall car. More aggressive look, and a bit more power cimpared to the 3rd gens. At least that's how I saw it as a kid lol

[Mezzy]

IIll own a nice iroc before Im dead. It's on my list of desired cars to own before i die, lol

[Mezzy]

I've owned countless grand nationals and got tired of no torque,lol would like to own a 69 camaro, 88 SS Monte, an Iroc, an SS impala, from the 90s, chevelle or gto. All in due time.

[WildBillyT]

I've owned countless grand nationals and got tired of no torque,lol would like to own a 69 camaro, 88 SS Monte, an Iroc, an SS impala, from the 90s, chevelle or gto. All in due time.

You may be the only guy on the planet who does not want a Grand National.

[Mezzy]

Really? They're so finicky with all those sensors. I used to call em sensor eaters,lol. Couldn't keep up with them blowing all the time.

[Mezzy]

DDont get me wrong, I still love em. But I had em before they were collectables

[Mike]

You may be the only guy on the planet who does not want a Grand National.

:wavey:

[1320B4U]

Damn mezzy. It matters not if a 4th gen is a better car to drive than a 2nd or 3rd gen (personally perference though). Some folks still like driving on bias ply tires. Regardless of hp #'s, .....bottomline camaros and firebirds will continue to appreciate in value given a long enough timeline....as will vettes regardless of any year. They won't attain the value of 1st gen's but you will see the value increase if the vehicle is in good shape....i happen to be the product of 80s cars and just love the box style look of the monte/cutlass 4-4-2 lightning rod cars, caprices, pre-87 full size pickups and pre '93 s10's etc. From what i see, the majority of folks that have 3rd gens don't feel for the 4th gens that much and vice versa...its a matter of opinion.

[jam01]

i don't get some of this, while i am sure not every 4th gen will be worth millions of dollars just like every 69 is not. it comes down to who wants what and availability, condition, rarity. when i was shopping for my 02 it had to be an ss six speed, that was in 2004. at the time there really weren't that many around with all the options i was going to order my car with, hell i drove to Delaware for it, yes there were some closer but not what i wanted. i overpaid with the financing but i did not care at the time. last year i bought my bosses 71 chevelle for $2,000. while it needs body work i know it was taken care of and has low miles, i think it was a fair price its nothing special 307 powerslide it and does have air. no one knows what the market will do in the future.

[Mezzy]

I agreed with you in an earlier post 132. 80s cars are awesome. No doubt about it. I owned em all at some point. Gonna start collecting them again.

[Camambro]

Starting this thread everywhere huh?

[LTb1ow]

Starting this thread everywhere huh?

Where else is it?

[V]

Starting this thread everywhere huh?

I wonder if stuff like that was the basis for the ban-hammer over at Camaro Forums.

[Fozzi58]

Everyone here has thrown their opinion into the ring and that's exactly what it is - opinion cause I'm pretty sure no one here has a crystal ball that actually works. However there are a bunch of facts people are hitting on so I decided to throw my 2 cents into it since I am an economy hobbyist.

The actual value of these cars are always going to be determined by the markets and how well the economy is doing. The extra disposable income people have will decide the "big money" factors over true value of the vehicles. Rarity will pay a part, production numbers, the special models or limited runs, and what kinds of choice people made at the times will all play a part into the value of the 3rd and 4th gens. Last but not least, as always, value is in the eye of the beholder.

There will always be models that will hold more value than others: The 1999 Anny TA, 2002 CETA, 35th Anny SS, 30th Anny z28, The 94 Pace car Camaro, and of course the GMMGs, Mecham's Hurst & Harley Davidson TAs, etc. Personally, the demise of Pontiac and the fact that more people bought WS6's instead of plain TA's is a great thing and I hope it skyrockets the value of my car...mostly because its my car. But in reality it will hold its current value for the next 5 ~ 7 years and go up slightly once the 25 year threshold is crossed. But there will most likely be no BIG MONEY in my car, even as rare as it is.

But in 15 years, if Barry O's crystal ball comes to fruition with a humming middle class and growing jobs and lots of GEN X'ers such as myself closing in on retirement with lots of disposable income, there may very well be a boom for the 82~02 F-Body. It will depend upon how much extra people have to spend on the extra's of life.

So the market and economy is going to be the factor that dictates value over all things. Rarity is a false hope because a 1977 Ford Granada is rare as hell, but I wouldn't pay you more than $100 for it.

Some sure targets that will more than likely return the dollar you spent on it or even make you a profit would be:

Factory Built
Any year firehawk (Considered factory even tho SLP in Toms River did the work)
Any anniversary Firebird (15th - '83 Maroon only);
89 Turbo TA and even better is the 20th anny pace car package
88 Factory notchback GTAs (Not a plain GTA with a stupid aftermarket one.
1992 LT1 or Police Package Z28
93 Pace car Z28
94 25th anni TA (Usually in Yellow - aka TA LE)
97 Camaro 30th anni
99 30th anni TA (White and blue; If you see anyone selling an "Inverse Anniversary TA, its a fake - blue with white stripes and white rims)
2002 CETA
2002 35th Anny TA
Super Rare: Harley Davidson TA (only 50 sold in California)

Aftermarket - Must be numbered
GMMG
Mecham
Hurst TA
Police Package Camaro's
Lingenfelter

Hope that helps in your seach.

[WSex]

^what about the 10 dpm tranams

[WildBillyT]

^what about the 10 dpm tranams

DPM?

[BonzoHansen]

purple.

rare <> valuable. I'm not sure color will drive prices too much.

[WildBillyT]

Could be. Same with the gold Camaros.

[BonzoHansen]

to clarify I tired to answer "will a certain color substantially drive a price enough to put them on a collectible list". I don’t think so. I do understand some colors are more desirable than others. So a hugger orange 1st gen is probably more desirable than some other colors which might uptick the price, but not substantially.

[grazi]

94 25th anni TA (Usually in Yellow - aka TA LE)

Hope that helps in your seach.

can you explain this car? yellow 25th anniv?

[TAdan]

can you explain this car? yellow 25th anniv?

I think he may be confusing some of the rare 94 Firebird models.

As you know the 25th T/A's were White and blue.

In 94 a handful (Maybe 5 or 6 total) of 25th T/A cars were upgraded to Firehawks by SLP.

In 1994 SLP built a Yellow 94 T/A pilot car. (At the time Firehawks were Formula based).

1983 featured the 25th Anniv. DT500 pace car replica T/A. White over grey.

1984 15th Anniversary T/A was a white car with blue pin striping. Not sure what he means by Maroon.

As far as the 1999 "Inverse" 30th Anniversary T/A's there are two recognized examples out there. One built by Pontiac and numbered "1 of 1." It was given away in a contest in 1999. The other was owner built, but recognized by Pontiac and PHS and given a "2 of 1" dash plaque.

[donnj]

the post mullet crowd will never compete for a 6 figure car, give it up guys and drive the **** outta the cars we enjoy and love. DO NOT ever look at a car as a investment, EVER....

[BonzoHansen]

the post mullet crowd will never compete for a 6 figure car, give it up guys and drive the **** outta the cars we enjoy and love. DO NOT ever look at a car as a investment, EVER....

I'm not really sure what you mean, but I agree in most cases never look at a car as a investment - at least for 99.9% of the people that will read this statement. but it is an asset with value that needs to be protected, some more than others of course.

[donnj]

"most will become big dollar collectables"
sorry, just dont EVER see it happening, the internet and WWW have put a ax to it all. They are F-body cars, not a 3 window 32 ford with a ardun flathead or a Yenko with a BB, you get the idea. And fwiw keeping something all original and peroid correct for 4O+ years with the barn dust on it and all with the hopes of someone going bonkers over one day and spending funny money like its going out of style just aint gonna happen. Its called supply and demand. Enjoy them for what they are is all im saying...

[Featherburner]

In 1994 SLP built a Yellow 94 T/A pilot car. (At the time Firehawks were Formula based).
There were 93 T/A Firehawks. So, why was there a pilot car in 94?

[TAdan]

There were 93 T/A Firehawks. So, why was there a pilot car in 94?



The T/A body was not a normal production option on the Firehawk until the 1999 year. The 93-97 T/A based Firehawks were "pilot" or special production cars only. Some were made by SLP to investigate including a T/A model. Others were modified when an owner would send their T/A to SLP after it was purchased from a dealer. There numbers are very limited. The regular LT1 Firehawks were Formula based.

(95-97 Comp T/A's and 98 Pilot cars excluded).

[Fozzi58]

can you explain this car? yellow 25th anniv?

Your car is the official 25th car, of which 250 verts and 1750 hard tops (1412 have T-Tops) were produced. A rare find indeed if you have one, especially a vert. Unfortunately no vert M6's were made. But your avy is a respected piece of automotive history. It usually has the "LE" tag accompanied but it is really an anniversary edition.

I was getting confused with the Comp T/A "Tirebird" that a handful were made in 95-97 and the 95 Indy 500 Richmond TA. And there's the 1995 Pro Am also. I do remember reading something about a yellow TA LE a while back but nothing on the internetz is coming up about it.

[Fozzi58]

Dug a little deeper and found this list on LS1tech:

http://ls1tech.com/forums/special-edition-vehicles/1008301-very-interesting-list-firebirds.html

[Mezzy]

All valid points

[NjbadSS]

Dont know if i would call a high 13 second car "Beastly"......

I laughed when I read this...Considering the third gen cars had hp numbers around what a 3.8 v6 f body had factory, which is a joke to me. So given that, I would say a stock car such as the ls1 ws6 or ss camaro, which had about 350 hp and with a good driver could hit high 12's in the 1/4 mile is pretty beastly. Also, no way in hell can anyone doubt the fact that an ls1 ws6 is not an absolutely sexy, mean looking car. No car enthusiast no matter what type of vehicle they are fans of can doubt that! Therefor, yes I can agree the beastly 4th gens got me hooked also considering i always loved the looks of the 3rd gens

[Mezzy]

You still didn't answer the question

[donnj]

sorry to say, No

[NjbadSS]

i can see some becoming valuable, not comparable to the 60s muscle cars but more then some think. For example look at mint low miles ls1 WS6 cars now... you still see some selling for 18k or more. I feel as if some of the previously mentioned 4th gens will one day be worth quite a bit of money because of their rarity and how popular they are

[Mezzy]

The farther away the new car designs get from the 4th gen look, the more the 4th gens will rise in value. As far as the Pontiac's go, new birds will never be produced again. There value will rise before Camaros do. Excellent shape trans Ams and formulas will be worth big money in say 20 more years once they are 30-40 years old. They' were the first return of real muscle in 20 years when they were new. They'll be worth some dough for sure. When you can't get em anymore, mint cond ones will be worth some coin.

[Mike]

The farther away the new car designs get from the 4th gen look, the more the 4th gens will rise in value. As far as the Pontiac's go, new birds will never be produced again. There value will rise before Camaros do. Excellent shape trans Ams and formulas will be worth big money in say 20 more years once they are 30-40 years old. They' were the first return of real muscle in 20 years when they were new. They'll be worth some dough for sure. When you can't get em anymore, mint cond ones will be worth some coin.

May might and maybe. This is all speculation

[Jersey Mike]

May might and maybe. This is all speculation

That's the basis of this whole thread--"Do you think..."

[LTb1ow]

I cant get a ford pinto mint anymore, but i certainly dont want one either.

4th gens are crappy plastic cars with no real soul, sell em or drive em like you should

[1320B4U]

The farther away the new car designs get from the 4th gen look, the more the 4th gens will rise in value. As far as the Pontiac's go, new birds will never be produced again. There value will rise before Camaros do. Excellent shape trans Ams and formulas will be worth big money in say 20 more years once they are 30-40 years old. They' were the first return of real muscle in 20 years when they were new. They'll be worth some dough for sure. When you can't get em anymore, mint cond ones will be worth some coin.


LOL...really? Listen, i'm no diehard 4th gen fan, but a SOM ss or ws6 is a nice looking car when done right. You could say the return of the muscle car was w/the 5th gen being it held a lot of the principles of the 60's cars. Usable trunk, wide open engine bay, no flip up lights, high side beltline etc etc. I see it w/3rd gens more now and eventually 4th gens when folks try to sell them, they think theirs is worth money because there are less around..true and untrue depending on condition and options. As for designs of new cars deviating from the 4th gen looks, increasing their value does that mean the buick renedevious or aztek will increase in value b/c nothing looks like them being built today?...fail. If you plan on driving your 401k be prepared to work till your dead.

[sweetbmxrider]

Just because a car is listed at $20k, doesn't mean its selling for $20k.

[bossmancb]

If 4th gens are going to increase in value it better happen after I get mine :)

not that I ll ever sell an 02 ws6 once I get my hands on it ;)

[PolarBear]

F-bodys are NOT muscle cars, please stop saying that

[87irocNJ]

I graduated HS in 88 and I remember some rich kid at our school had an 87 iroc and I loved it. The sound, the look. It was a great car. Two years ago I came by an 87 iroc convertible with a manual trans and under 60k miles and I got it for a good price. I've put decent money in to beefing up the suspension and I have a great weekend fun car for under $10k. I don't know if it'll go up in value, but if I had bought a new 5th gen, the car would have depreciated more than the entire cost of my 3rd gen already and I get far more looks and compliments than a 5th gen owner ever would. Go up in value? Maybe, maybe not, but all the depreciation is definitely out of the car and it isn't going down in value. But it's all about taking the kids out on a warm spring day, taking the top down and letting the engine roar as we cruise around town. To me that's priceless and the relative difference between doing it in an 87 iroc or a 69 isn't worth 4 times the money. I never liked the 4th gens and I'm not all about my 1/4 mile time. Just a style preference and a recollection of one of the only new cars worth owning when I was just getting in to cars.

[Mezzy]

Yeah, I just fell in love with that Iroc too as a 13 year old kid in 1985. Also loved the G body Grand Nationals and Monte SSs. It's all about what you fell in love with as an influential kid. But once the 4th gens came out w much more of everything, I just knew that was the car I needed to have. Now I have 3 beautiful 4th gens one being ultra rare.