Winter purchase

[zraffz]

I have been dying to own another 4th gen since I sold my last one over a year ago and with winter coming up I figured it was the chance to get a good deal on one.

This car started as a V6 and had the hood, spoiler, interior, harness, computer, dash, motor and trans stuffed into it from a 97 SS.

Motor is .030", forged mahle flat tops, moly rings, scat forged "pro comp" i-beams, stock crank turned .010". Heads were ported by a local NJ shop with 2.02 1.6 valves installed, CC503, 58mm TB, new opti, waterpump, ported intake, long tubes, ORY with an electric cutout, magnaflow exhaust, mallory ignition box (2 stage limiter and window switch), walbro fuel pump, founders LCA brackets and arms, aftermarket panhard bar, bmr subframe connectors, ls1 front brakes with drilled and slotted rotors all around, lowered on hotchkis springs, adjustable rear shocks.
Stage 2 Texas Drivetrain Performance T56 with a Ram Powergrip HD clutch.

275/40/16's all around on ZO6 replica wheels, HIDs and much more... only thing stock is the rear (said he blew two already) with 3.42s. Car went 12.80's on a 2.1 60' with 2.73 gears.

Almost $20,000 in receipts and 1,800 miles on it since all this was done to the car. Car was flawless before I smashed the front into the tow dolly and luckily only took off a little bit of paint :facepalm:


Car has a fueling issue on the left bank. Haven't had much time to check it out at the shop but we hooked the scanner up and saw injectors 1,3,5,7 at 136% cycle constantly.

http://i44.tinypic.com/o9myr8.jpg
http://i44.tinypic.com/rbl85l.jpg
http://i41.tinypic.com/jsfuyx.jpg

[maroman88]

looks very nice!

[zraffz]

Thanks, the car was a total steal. PO lost interest in it when he bought his new car (one of those Genesis cars).

Still haven't messed around with it. Tomorrow I'll check over some of the wiring to make sure the drivers are the problem and get in touch with madz28 :)

This will be the second defective PCMForLess computer I've seen in the past year.

[coolmanvette75]

Looks great! I'm biased on the color though ;) . Wanna sell the hood? :)

[sweetbmxrider]

Any update on this? I have similar issues on my car and I have a pcmforless tune too :(

[zraffz]

Well I just got it running correct tonight.

PO said it started running like crap after getting gas and going to a car show. On the way home it acted up. He got it home and switched the o2 sensors around and apparently he did a full tune up but never mentioned that part to me.

I got it on my lift and found one of his o2 extensions was shorting the high impedance signal to the ground on that harness. Also checked fuel pressure, injectors and plugs. Car still ran like crap. One O2 was bad, the MAF was bad, MAP sensor had a vacuum leak, motor was sucking air past the MAF and we found a few more questionable wires. I ordered a MadZ28 (Mad Tuner) tune and it ran a bit better... detonation at idle issue went away.

In fact, my buddy had it running long enough to get the SES light to start flashing (telling us it had a misfire) and then it died 15 seconds later. I was about to check the cap & rotor on the opti and as the coolant was draining down I decided to go over the firing order and noticed 5 & 7 were backwards... lmao. It only took me 16 hours to figure out that the final issue was the firing order :(

Anyway, I did plugs and wires and went to fire it up and it didn't do anything. I checked for spark and didn't have any fuel pressure BUT I head the fuel pump priming. I disconnected the line before the fuel filter and still had nothing happening. I took the pump out (thank god the PO did a fuel pump access hole) and tested it in a bucket of water; pump kicks on and spins but doesn't suck.

Got my new pump and the car is running. Hard for me to pinpoint what my issue was because I feel like it was several things but the main issue was defiantly the shorted O2 sensor, crossed wires and MAF.

[LTb1ow]

So, PCMforless messed up all that?

[greenformula92]

Good to see its running. We are gonna need a video now lmao

[zraffz]

So, PCMforless messed up all that?

I am not saying that. Their tune or ECM was defiantly not 100% correct but it was just part of the big picture of issues. Don't forget I took over somebody else's project and changed many things along the way of fixing it.

I took the car for a spin last night and i was left with very mixed emotions. The car with 3.42s is difficult to drive with a 750 rpm idle, the cam and ported heads. Below 1,800 rpms the car bucks and surges at cruising speeds. The car feels fast for the cam it has and it handles and stops very well. Defiantly needs gears to make it more enjoyable to drive but I don't really want anymore power in a street driven car... It already blows the tires off at 35 mph.

[The_Bishop]

You might need a tune to correct the below-1800-bucking. Not a mail-order, an actual dyno tune.

[greenformula92]

You might need a tune to correct the below-1800-bucking. Not a mail-order, an actual dyno tune.

You took the words right out from under me

[zraffz]

You might need a tune to correct the below-1800-bucking. Not a mail-order, an actual dyno tune.

I hope not lol. I'm hoping gears will fix it. I've had a 355 with 200cc runners and a comparable cam and it bucked pretty bad with 3.23s.

Anyway an idle video can be seen here:
Mobile link: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=V8FbY3rSEkI&app=m
V8FbY3rSEkI

[sweetbmxrider]

You might need a tune to correct the below-1800-bucking. Not a mail-order, an actual dyno tune.

Sounds like the tune isn't that great. I don't know if they dyno tune for non-wot tuning, usually just drive it on the street.

[LTb1ow]

Sounds like the tune isn't that great. I don't know if they dyno tune for non-wot tuning, usually just drive it on the street.

Mine was, easier on a mustang dyno to replicate driving conditions. Not sure on a dynojet.

[AintQik]

That car looks great. I know its a bit tougher on those, but a good tuner can do wonders for surging. I've had a bunch say some of my cars were impossible only to find one guy that took the time and "bam" it was like magic.

Obviously, and I know you know this, but make sure all the issues are without question worked out before hand. Nothing like a little unmetered air to make a tune impossible.

[sweetbmxrider]

Mine was, easier on a mustang dyno to replicate driving conditions. Not sure on a dynojet.

They looked at your car and decided that was best.

[The_Bishop]

Gears will not fix the bucking. Use the money for a tune, not gears.

[sweetbmxrider]

Sounds good by the way.

[Dudbird113]

I know my tuner (efx) tunes the car for drivabilty by tuning it on the street. He has a mustang dyno put nothing similates driving on the road then actually driving it.

[zraffz]

Interesting thing happened today. CEL popped on... bank 2 sensor 1 no activity (think I've figured out my surging at low RPMs). I don't know why it didn't kick on sooner; car was left running for a while without it coming on... of course I smelled fuel (not nearly as bad as the other days) but I figured it was just residual burning of old fuel in the exhaust.

Fun little LT1 fact that I never knew. Even though I had replaced that sensor, I did it on the cheap through my Napa Commercial account and they don't carry ACDelco O2 sensors. With the key forward and the motor off the resistance is 9mv. I chased the wires on that side to ensure nothing was broken. Seems a lot of newer vehicles had a resistance reading in that ballpark but this O2 sensor must not be LT1 compatible or defective.

I have true plug and play O2 extensions coming on the 18th (instead of having them spliced since it makes me uncomfortable since it already caused an issue once). Tomorrow I'll switch the sensors around and my issue will most likely switch banks.


...fingers crossed that I am in the clear now! Wanna start saving for a 12 bolt instead of throwing money at stupid things on this car [insert LT1 optispark joke here].

[greenformula92]

Wanna start saving up so I can wash my engine


Fixed lol

[Kat]

Nothing like buying someone else's project. :).

[sweetbmxrider]

Certain parameters have to be met before the CEL will set, I am assuming the battery was disconnected or computer reset at some point and the car was not driven enough to set the o2 monitor. Once that happened, the self tests will run at their appropriate times and set the CEL if a fault is discovered. 99% of the time, splicing o2 wiring yourself will result in issues, you are better off with the plug in extensions.

If the oxygen sensor pigtail wiring, the connector, or the terminal are damaged, replace the entire oxygen sensor assembly. Do not attempt to repair the wiring, the connector, or the terminals. In order for the sensor to function properly, the sensor must have a clean air reference provided to it. This clean air reference is obtained from the oxygen sensor wires. Any attempt to repair the wires, the connectors, or the terminals could result in the obstruction of the air reference. Any attempt to repair the wires, the connectors, or the terminals will degrade the oxygen sensor performance.

[The_Bishop]

On an unrelated note, I had those wheels on my '94, and I kinda miss them. What shape are the wheels in, any curb rash? What shape are the tires in?

Would you be interested in trading for another set of 17's?
http://home.comcast.net/~The_Bishop/camaro/Camaro2012s.jpg

Wheels are nearly new, only a couple hundred miles on them. Tires are Nexen N3000, 275/40/17 all around. Tires have about 2500 miles on 'em.

[zraffz]

On an unrelated note, I had those wheels on my '94, and I kinda miss them. What shape are the wheels in, any curb rash? What shape are the tires in?

Would you be interested in trading for another set of 17's?

Wheels are nearly new, only a couple hundred miles on them. Tires are Nexen N3000, 275/40/17 all around. Tires have about 2500 miles on 'em.
Wheels are 17" replicas and they look brand new but I am not interested in trading. It's got those stupid Riken Raptor 275/40/17 tires on it that last forever and don't smoke lol.


Nothing like buying someone else's project. :).
Yeah... what a nightmare lmao. I have to give him credit overall for the entire transplant though. It is very neatly done and looks original. I think a lot of the issues were related to age (dry rotted hoses, fragile wires, etc).

[townsend]

rikens smoke if you spin em fast enough lol

go to dave and have him do a tune, or if you want something to hold you over in the meantime talk to nate (sweet-94z28) on ltxtech. he did both tunes on both our cars and they are on point for driveability. fyi, i have my idle with the hotcam set at 800 and 850 on the le2 car. i think yours is a little low.

[The_Bishop]

Wheels are 17" replicas and they look brand new but I am not interested in trading. It's got those stupid Riken Raptor 275/40/17 tires on it that last forever and don't smoke lol.


Ah, well, it was worth a shot. :)

[WildBillyT]

Fun little LT1 fact that I never knew. Even though I had replaced that sensor, I did it on the cheap through my Napa Commercial account and they don't carry ACDelco O2 sensors. With the key forward and the motor off the resistance is 9mv. I chased the wires on that side to ensure nothing was broken. Seems a lot of newer vehicles had a resistance reading in that ballpark but this O2 sensor must not be LT1 compatible or defective.

I have true plug and play O2 extensions coming on the 18th (instead of having them spliced since it makes me uncomfortable since it already caused an issue once). Tomorrow I'll switch the sensors around and my issue will most likely switch banks.


Resistance should be in ohms or milliohms, not millivolts. Is that what you meant?

As far as splicing into the O2 circuit itself, that can be tricky. Since the circuit itself runs from 0-1000mv any extra resistance from a funky solder joint will mess up the readings. I'd bet that the extensions will make a difference in your case.

[zraffz]

rikens smoke if you spin em fast enough lol

go to dave and have him do a tune, or if you want something to hold you over in the meantime talk to nate (sweet-94z28) on ltxtech. he did both tunes on both our cars and they are on point for driveability. fyi, i have my idle with the hotcam set at 800 and 850 on the le2 car. i think yours is a little low.

Your cars are automatic. I think my madz28 tune is as good as anybody else will do mail order wise.


Besides ironing out the minor problem left, I am parking the car in my shop for the winter and not spending any more money on it. Just purchased a plow truck today and won't be driving the car until spring.

[zraffz]

O2 harnesses arrived, switched to ACDelco o2 sensors, noticed the PO had the throttle stop screwed out so the car was idling at 1,000 rpms... Sounds way better at 750 now!
Took it for a spin, drives much better without surging. Runs pretty strong.
Coming down a nice strait road it loses throttle response, I keep downshifting and tapping the pedal and I come to a stop and it stalls lol. Think the ICM is now getting heat soaked because after it sat for half an hour it fired right up perfectly fine. Pulled that BS where the SES flashed while holding steady at 3,500 but it defiantly wasn't missing and the live data scan wasn't catching any misfires.

[sweetbmxrider]

ICM won't effect throttle response if that is what you are inferring.

[WildBillyT]

O2 harnesses arrived, switched to ACDelco o2 sensors, noticed the PO had the throttle stop screwed out so the car was idling at 1,000 rpms... Sounds way better at 750 now!
Took it for a spin, drives much better without surging. Runs pretty strong.
Coming down a nice strait road it loses throttle response, I keep downshifting and tapping the pedal and I come to a stop and it stalls lol. Think the ICM is now getting heat soaked because after it sat for half an hour it fired right up perfectly fine. Pulled that BS where the SES flashed while holding steady at 3,500 but it defiantly wasn't missing and the live data scan wasn't catching any misfires.

Is the IAC valve pretty new? Not gunked up? What are the counts?

[zraffz]

ICM won't effect throttle response if that is what you are inferring.

I'm not certain what was going on when I had no throttle response. It seemed to be running perfectly fine while it was coasting minus the throttle not doing anything (don't forget this is a M6 car though). I can't see the TPS, IAC or ECM being the cause on its own. Even with a bad TPS it should bog or affect the idle when the butterflies in the throttle body open up. I feel like the ICM is getting heat soaked because it fired up after I left it alone for about half an hour. I need a few parts that are in questionable shape before I bother trying to diagnose this any more.

[sweetbmxrider]

It continued to run when you depressed the clutch while downshifting, right?

[zraffz]

It continued to run when you depressed the clutch while downshifting, right?
I'm not 100% certain what was happening. It sounded like it was running but I'm not sure if it was really running or if it was due to the motor still turning over in gear. Happened kinda fast and I was more focused on finding a safe spot to stop.

Regardless, if it was still running would that have something to due with the TPS? Most vehicles still do something even with it unplugged but I'm not certain about these cars. Haven't started to diagnose the car yet, kinda sucks pulling the car into the shop and jacking it up to get the lift arms under it.

[sweetbmxrider]

Well if you are depressing the clutch, the tires are no longer driving the motor. That's why I asked. The tps can be funny. Should be about .67 volts 0% throttle and above 4.5 100% throttle (I believe, might be a tad under that) with a smooth gain in voltage throughout the pedal travel. The closed loop warm IAC counts should be around 30-35. It sees the most action when coming to a stop. 160 is max open.

[zraffz]

Just a quick update... haven't had much time for the car in the past few weeks. It's running again and I decided to spoil myself with a few goodies for it. Waiting on a set of LS1 coils/brackets/custom wires, LTCC unit & window switch and an $802 bill from Nitrous Outlet (which will be damn near doubling very soon).

[donnj]

saw it on CL forsale, whats the plan with it?

[zraffz]

saw it on CL forsale, whats the plan with it?

Not really sure what I'm doing with it lol. Part of me wants to send it down the road and part of me wants to dump a few more grand into a 9" and drag radials and shoot for high 10's/low 11's on the 150 shot.