I think the 350z is not even in the same category. Doesn't look great, extremely annoying sound, and isn't any better of a performer than the Stang. At least the Camaro SHOULD be a better performer.

tim (njspeeder), pete (procamaro) and antiriceguy-

i disagree with all of you.

for one, pete said 350zs don't sell well and tim said they sell at a premium. which is it? the fact that i see far more Zs on the road says something about the sales of that car compared to the stang.

secondly, Tim, the 350z is hardly a turd. the car handles better than any factory fbody and is also far more comfortable. trust me, i've driven it. (buddy steve owns a 04 350z autotragic, meena owns a 07 stang with an intake and a shifter, and i own a 4th gen) my car has almost every suspension piece upgraded with a great deal of research put into it, and it barely outhandles the Z. its a great driving car, its just a shame its a typical hunk of crap courtesy of nissan. don't believe me that people don't care for power? look at teh rx8. 15 second ride that is selling great and is loved by track drivers and magazine writers)

thirdly, antiriceguy- what are you talking about? its not too far behind the stang in acceleration and then beats it in every other aspect.

what i'm saying is horsepower is cheap. we all know you can make any car fast or you can drive fast in any car. but a well built and well balanced machine is a whole other story. the GTO, that car had it all, but the looks and the appeal. i have a muscle car thats fun as heck to scorch the tires with. but thats me. thats not what the majority of people want. i'll sacrifice horsepower for the sake of handling, braking, and a well-manored ride. the corvette is almost there, it just needs an interior that can rival the foreigners.

whatim saying iv sold alot more mustangs than i sold z's stangs are good for the price but nissan advertises 307hp for the z having driven the crap out of one, that is B/S the cars feels mad slow b/c it lacks serious torque, but it handles amazing... what im tryin to say is how much is the camaro gonna go for b/c the stangs are pretty strong w/ the bang for buck factor and after market parts for it are much cheaper and so abundant which is my prob w/ f bodies other than that ill take f body all day because they are the better car and theres only soo many parts ill buy

jake, don't trust magazine reviews of cars. these are the same people that declared the yugo one of the best built cars in history and the honda ridgeline the truck of the year.

but i have driven a Z and a stang and a 4th gen. i'm going by what i see. i see the vast majority wanting a better handling car. more hp = more gas and speeding tickets. its inevitable. and the fact that people don't care for sports cars anymore and the popularity of rich youth driving sports sedans and coupes says alot. agreed?

examples? miata, honda s2000, mini, wrx, rx8. and on the higher end: g35, lexus, BMWs, TL

Dont forget the Cadillac STS and CTS

cts maybe, certainly no STS

I think the STS is a pretty hot car. The have the STS-V:drool:
http://www.cadillac.com/cadillacjsp/...?model=vseries

sorry, but if you're in high school and you're driving a caddy.. it's a grandpa's car no matter how quick it is

not when i was in HS, one of the nicest cars in the lot was a CTS when they first came out, the kids dad was a caddy dealer, everyone knew what it was and liked it, now hes got a CTS-V

I dont know about that. The high school next to were my wife works there are quite a few caddy's that the students drive.

My point was that for the extra money, it better be comfier and well-appointed. Although I know I am in the minority when I say that I've ridden in an 07 GT w/only mods as SLP catback and it rode gloriously, seats were very comfy. I have yet to be in a 350z, however. If you look on Edmunds for both cars, the main complaint about the 350z is trunk space. That's kind of a major flaw in my book considering most of these cars are not weekend warriors. I can't find skidpad and such for both cars though. However, I see wayyy more modified mustangs than 350z's. They are being sold to different markets.

http://www.edmunds.com/nissan/350z/2...merreview.html

http://www.edmunds.com/ford/mustang/...merreview.html

I've driven em too and to say I disagree would be an understatement. Not too comfortable and the thing's got no balls.

roommate has an 06 stang...car rides awesome...

No, and no the GT isnt loaded for 25k. Loaded GT hits near 30k.
Camaro will be priced similar to the Mustang.

Fbodies stop selling for probably a ton of reasons.
The GTO didnt fail because of price. GTO failed because it had a stupid badge on it. Had it been called Monaro, it would have sold out. But then, people would have bitched and said "2 doors coupe, V8, performance RWD, hood scoops...THIS SHOULD AHVE BEEN CALLED GTO, WTF IS A MONARO?"
But whatever, its over, G8 is here.

2 letters, No

Its design is your opinion, and varies. I think that the 350Z is right now the best looking sports coupe for under 35k. The Mustang, outside of the GT500, looks like a 67 left in the microwave too long, and then swelled up. Its a pig, its ugly, its heavy, it uses a suspension so similar to a third gen that GM could probably file a law suit, its interior parts feel like they should have a rubbermaid symbol on them, its truck V6 and truck V8 are horrible and have enough power because there is nothing else in the market. Its design is growing old, and it sales are falling off. People want something new, and its not "too late" for GM and Camaro. In fact, it just might be time for a change. Late to the party, but Camaro will bring the best gifts since 2002.

Compared to your 4th gen, Im sure. Compare it to a 350Z, the upcoming Camaro, or any other sports coupe on market now, be it FWD or RWD, I would probably put Mustang dead last. I would even say that the 2 ton Challenger will put it to shame.

During the Hot Rod Power tour the SCCA had an Autocross event. I am no professional driver, but my Bird out performed every Stang, and Z that took to the course. Here is one of my runs. It was alot of fun.


http://video.cardomain.com/clip.aspx...AFDC798247AFF0

It looks good to me.. The power output of the LS-3 will change a few opinions..

Regardless I think it will still be a dud, retro design cars only hold the markets attention spans for a short time until the next new thing comes then the sales drop..
Just like the Mustang did..
I Hope Gm has already started the next styling for it..

looks like a 4,000lb Chrysler..plus if they can't keep it near 3300/3400lbs I'll never buy one...any 4th Gen Fbody knows weight + power = break everything. I'd rather get a vette.

Everything I've heard (which isn't much) said they were trying to keep it at/under 3600 lbs. Not sure if that includes the convertible or not. If so, I'd consider that pretty good. I've heard of several LS1 T/A verts weighing in close to 3800 lbs, and the new car will have IRS (heavier).

- Justin

and also stronger chassis, more interior goodies, and more safety garbage. 3600# is light by todays standards

Here's Settlemire's reaction: http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showth...4026#post34026



He's got a few more posts in the thread, too

Its not gunna be 2 tons. Target is 3600lbs. You just can no longer make a light weight car now that there are so many crash standards, saftey standards, standard air bags, and other electronic systems that need to keep you safe.
The Camaro team is working hard on cutting pounds, shedding weight, while still giving us a platform to build a serious performance car on. Its not like they are building a cheap compact car, they are making a performance car. I would assume that Camaro's weight will be on par with Mustang, and probably lighter when Ford adapts IRS for the next gen Mustang.

nice post kasey. settlemire is hilarious

IDK that I like the black door handles and the black mirriors. I havent decided how I feel about the ovedrall car though...I guess only time will tell on that one....but I do <3 the white :drool:

I'm going to assume that mirrors and door handles will be body color....the pics here are still camouflaged, so they do things like that so you can't see the overall look of the car.

Here's the same shot with inverted colors to show the body lines better than the white does:

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/attach...1&d=1197555039

- Justin