Anyone have experiance with alcohol? - NJFBOA - Home of New Jersey's Camaros and Firebirds

alamantia · 04-01-2007, 08:53 PM

...and i mean alcohol injection you wise-asses. Were haveing a hard time starting the one car. As you know or incase you dint know you can not start an alcohol injected car cold on pure methanol (alcohol) you need a small amount of gas in a seperate tank and a purge pump to pump gas into the cylinders on initial cold start up. If its a hot day and the engine is hot it will fire. Another thing methanol requires is a more powerful spark that can be generated form a conventional starter so you need a pro mag. Now a pro mag needs at least 200RPM to fire, so you need to upgrade to a 24 volt starter to spin the motor faster. Now we did that but are still having trouble firing the car. Has anyone on here had experiance using the new CSR 139 toothflexplate / started system?

http://www.csr-performance.com/new_products.html

if so, how did you like it? sorry if this is in the wrong forum.

79CamaroDiva · 04-01-2007, 09:01 PM

i dont think you'll get a response about this on here, but i could be mistaken.

i use a gas primer that i THINK is from ron's injection. i LOVE it, start and warm the car up on gas, then switch to alcohol whenever i need to. it works great.

alamantia · 04-01-2007, 09:06 PM

i dont know where else to try at 10PM on a sunday night, I will ask the engine builder next time we speak.

Oh yeah...

PS: To all you devils fans who said the rangers would not make the playoffs SUCK MY BALLS, i just heard they beat Toronto... eh, who cares anyway, Yankee home opener tomorrow...

-edit-

Id would love to work for a company called "Rons injection" even more so if my name was Ron

79CamaroDiva · 04-01-2007, 09:10 PM

http://www.ronsfuel.com/accessories.cfm abotu halfway down is the primer set up...

edit: actually i lied... this is the one with the spray bar i was talking about... http://www.killerrons.com/primer.cfm

alamantia · 04-01-2007, 09:13 PM

we do use the primer system, not sure if its rons, and timing is set at 32 degrees on a retard at start up. We even tried cam2 instead of regular gas and still had some trouble getting it to go. It goes, but it aint easy. Next time you see Scott ask him if he ever tried the flexplate on his firebird, i saw him using the toilet for a while with that car, only thing is I think this flywheel came out before he bought joes dragster

NJSPEEDER · 04-01-2007, 09:24 PM

i am gonna roll this into the tech forum to see if it generates more help for you. good luck with it.

shane27 · 04-01-2007, 09:56 PM

no clue but i love the avatar

alamantia · 04-02-2007, 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NJSPEEDER

i am gonna roll this into the tech forum to see if it generates more help for you. good luck with it.

cool, i just know the lounge gets wayyy more exposure. Thanks!

johnjzjz · 04-02-2007, 08:00 AM

we ran 2 different alky injection systems - one with out a primer and one with the primer it has the advantage 2 different ways - one its able to put heat in the motor with out using the fuel shut off to lean the mixture ( never liked that idea ) second its easer on the battery's and starter system - we had to go to a 3 HP starter and a 1000 amp battery because we ran the compression # 14 / 15 to one it had 255 static on the starter -- and you do not need a pro mag to run alky - only the 10 percent of the monkey see monkey do guys have them -- but you do need a starter system that is un caring of high compression hot or cold it needs to spin freely and fast -- almost all the guys have a MSD 7 3 AL with either the pro coil or the new one forgot the name will have to look on the car -- the mag has its good points and bad -- but it does sound like you have way too much start retard to an alky set up - if your initial advance is 38 deg you only want 10 deg tops on the retard - otherwise the timing will be so late it will flood - sputter and back fire at times -- jz

alamantia · 04-02-2007, 09:53 AM

timing is set at 32 when running and at 6 (i believe he has it) for start up. The primer system seems to be operating fine. Everything appears to be operational, and the car does eventually start. Im just wondering if anyone has run the flexplate. If anyone has any opinion on weather it improves starting RPM's and makes start up faster, or, if its just another waist of money.

johnjzjz · 04-02-2007, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alamantia

timing is set at 32 when running and at 6 (i believe he has it) for start up. The primer system seems to be operating fine. Everything appears to be operational, and the car does eventually start. Im just wondering if anyone has run the flexplate. If anyone has any opinion on weather it improves starting RPM's and makes start up faster, or, if its just another waist of money.

when its all said and done you will find out you do not have enough timing to make it start crisp - try it with out the start retard -- the smaller flywheel does make it spin faster thats for sure -- but the speed of cranking i dont think is the problem -- just my take been doing it a while beeen their done that kind of thing -- jz

alamantia · 04-03-2007, 09:10 AM

So your saying try starting it at 32 degrees rather than 10? I'll try it but I would think that would make it worse... maybe i dont understand. Feel free to let me know if I am not following you.

johnjzjz · 04-03-2007, 07:13 PM

the last two alky motors we ran - now they in no way are top sporstman but are fast for what they are sedans - we started the one with a BBC at 38 Deg and no start retard at all --- and the other was a high end sbc 15 to one and NO START RETARD -- they would turn over once or twice and fire ever time - when we used the retard we had at least 10 alky fires the ones you cant see from back firing -- its just my first hand experence being singed more that once -- jz

alamantia · 04-03-2007, 09:37 PM

good to know. The Crain set up we have allows for start retard with some box between the mag and the chip. Im still learning. My brother knows a lot but hes a little stumped on why it takes 2-3 times to fire up. I may just want to try it at 32 at start up and see if its any easier, Id think it would be worse, but whatever. Ill try it.

johnjzjz · 04-04-2007, 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alamantia

good to know. The Crain set up we have allows for start retard with some box between the mag and the chip. Im still learning. My brother knows a lot but hes a little stumped on why it takes 2-3 times to fire up. I may just want to try it at 32 at start up and see if its any easier, Id think it would be worse, but whatever. Ill try it.

The Crain set up we have allows for start retard with some box between the mag and the chip.

i remember one of the cars we race with having that set up and they make a relay we use on high compression bikes ( i HAVE IN STOCK ) it goes between the mag and the box what it does is stop the voltage drop - that happens when you engage the starter -- its believed the voltage drop stops the retard from working and it will only re excites after you try to start and catch it just right - again i don't know how or what really might be the problem you guys are having -- the relays are the small Bosch type and don't remember but i think 10 bucks not sure - jz

alamantia · 04-04-2007, 12:55 PM

cool man, thanks for the advice, were going out again next weekend to see whats up, if I need to play with the ignition system I will confir with my brother and contact you for parts if needed.