New COPO Camaros? - NJFBOA - Home of New Jersey's Camaros and Firebirds

JL8Jeff · 12-20-2009, 02:52 PM

I was just reading a thread on the Yenko board about GM wanting to build some new COPO Camaros to compete with the new Mustang Cobrajets and Drag Pack Challengers.

Quote:

These will be race only no VIN cars with factory open headers, supercharger, and solid axle! All of the specs. are not yet nailed down and no price has been set by GM.

They are also selling the cars as a "body in white" which is what they used to do to racers who wanted to build cars from a shell. Here's one of the "body in white" cars.

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BigAls87Z28 · 12-20-2009, 03:08 PM

GM will not spend the money to design a solid axle set up for this car.

69BirdX · 12-20-2009, 03:15 PM

Would be pretty sweet if they did.

sweetbmxrider · 12-20-2009, 03:17 PM

old. i saw a white 5th gen at the dealer yesterday. man those things look great!

JL8Jeff · 12-20-2009, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigAls87Z28

GM will not spend the money to design a solid axle set up for this car.

This racer is working with GM to get this done. GM will only do it if they know all the cars will be pre-sold. I wouldn't be surprised if it gets done with half the buyers being racers and the other half being investors who think the cars will be worth money in the future. It will be interesting to follow along to see if there is enough interest.

WildBillyT · 12-20-2009, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JL8Jeff

This racer is working with GM to get this done. GM will only do it if they know all the cars will be pre-sold. I wouldn't be surprised if it gets done with half the buyers being racers and the other half being investors who think the cars will be worth money in the future. It will be interesting to follow along to see if there is enough interest.

I have seen this all as well, actually a little while ago. Saw the body-in-white in yellow, though.

BigAls87Z28 · 12-20-2009, 03:28 PM

The rear set up can handle 600hp from the factory. Why not just invest money into making that stronger, lets say from a program that was shelved before Chap11?
Redesigning the rear end would cost a lot of money...a lot. What they are saying is that they are going to create a whole new car. Redesign the whole back end of the car?
Not going to happen. Its easier to put IRS in a solid axle car, but its damn near reinventing the wheel going the other way. Its been done to other cars before, but this chassis is designed in a much different mannor then lets say a Corvette.

69BirdX · 12-20-2009, 03:28 PM

Not so sure about the challengers but the mustang cobra jets sold pretty damn good. Either racers or collectors bought them. They were pretty pricey to. Dodge put a solid rear In the challengers. They spent the money to redesign

BonzoHansen · 12-20-2009, 03:49 PM

Damn old guys & their wanna-be collector terms, lol. Nothing 'COPO' about it. It's just a race body in white. It's not an assembly line built 427 that isn't in the catalog but has a vin and is otherwise street legal. And I've already seen them tubbed with 4 links & solid axles, by both look-at-me builders and real racers.

Jeff, I see all these stupid 'collector' versions out there no. Nickey, Yenko (really, that one is borderline offensive to me), and so forth. BFD. Collectors get their panties wet just thinking about it. Yea! A few bolt-on HP or a GM crate LS9, stripes, wheels & look at me crap. Maybe better brakes. At least the 4th gen Harrell cars had the cool flares and such, and generally unobtainium engines for that time. Too bad most of those live in garages & trailers too. I'd wager most 69 Camaro COPOs/Yenkos/ZL1s/etc. were driven and/or raced like there were intended.

I totally get treating them good now, 40 years later when they represent the best there was, not is. Restored they are time capsules. But these new collector cars represent the worst in the car hobby to me.

Anti_Rice_Guy · 12-20-2009, 03:50 PM

But will they have a Berger Panel?

LTb1ow · 12-20-2009, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BonzoHansen

Damn old guys & their wanna-be collector terms, lol. Nothing 'COPO' about it. It's just a race body in white. It's not an assembly line built 427 that isn't in the catalog but has a vin and is otherwise street legal. And I've already seen them tubbed with 4 links & solid axles, by both look-at-me builders and real racers.

Jeff, I see all these stupid 'collector' versions out there no. Nickey, Yenko (really, that one is borderline offensive to me), and so forth. BFD. Collectors get their panties wet just thinking about it. Yea! A few bolt-on HP or a GM crate LS9, stripes, wheels & look at me crap. Maybe better brakes. At least the 4th gen Harrell cars had the cool flares and such, and generally unobtainium engines for that time. Too bad most of those live in garages & trailers too. I'd wager most 69 Camaro COPOs/Yenkos/ZL1s/etc. were driven and/or raced like there were intended.

I totally get treating them good now, 40 years later when they represent the best there was, not is. Restored they are time capsules. But these new collector cars represent the worst in the car hobby to me.

Yea, no LT1.

JL8Jeff · 12-20-2009, 03:56 PM

I agree, I hate all these Nickey, Yenko, Baldwin/Motion wannabe cars. And these so called "COPO" cars won't evend have a VIN, that's not a car that can be titled and registered. It might be built in a COPO type fashion but it's not even a legal Camaro without the paperwork and VIN. It's a cool idea to help real racer's out with the body in white but why bother with anything else? Let the racers build it the way they want it.

BonzoHansen · 12-20-2009, 04:00 PM

I think GM would be wary of selling them too close to streetable. Legal reasons.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LTs1ow

Yea, no LT1.

Join the ranks of the LT-1 owners! Solid lifters FTW! Just save your $$.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti_Rice_Guy

But will they have a Berger Panel?

Only a Berger car can, I suppose. Otherwise it's a black tail pan, like all the 1st & 2nd gen BB cars (except dark colors). And of course 77 Z28s and 76-77 RS cars.

actually I need to verify the BBC 2nd gen comment - Jeff?

iroc86NJ · 12-20-2009, 04:13 PM

Haven't these bodies been for sales for a few months? I remember first hearing about them earlier this year.

As far as them being converted into COPO/Yenko street cars it's never going to happen. GM's intendes to sell these bodies to Professional race teams, at least that's what I've read.

69BirdX · 12-20-2009, 04:23 PM

You can get around the no Vin thing. Register it as a kit car

NastyEllEssWon · 12-20-2009, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iroc86NJ

Haven't these bodies been for sales for a few months? I remember first hearing about them earlier this year.

As far as them being converted into COPO/Yenko street cars it's never going to happen. GM's intendes to sell these bodies to Professional race teams, at least that's what I've read.

http://www.njfboa.org/forums/showthr...aro+body+white

yup this is actually a repost from the same time last year.

JL8Jeff · 12-20-2009, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NastyEllEssWon

http://www.njfboa.org/forums/showthr...aro+body+white

yup this is actually a repost from the same time last year.

Nope, not a repost. This post is about them building a COPO car for racing. I added the body in white because it was that particular racer who is working with GM and he posted his BIW. Reading and understanding ftw!

NastyEllEssWon · 12-20-2009, 05:00 PM

lol they want like 8k just for the body in white...how much do you think gm will want for a supercharged, open header, solid axle car...especially when the ls9 (similar style motor to what your speaking of im assuming....) which crate motors are like 24k for......30k or more for a ''race only'' camaro that cant even be titled is just really ftl

sweetbmxrider · 12-20-2009, 05:12 PM

not really. there are plenty of racecars that are wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyy more then that. its a pretty good deal.

SteveR · 12-20-2009, 05:13 PM

Nothing COPO about it. And GM would have to build 50 identical cars for NHRA to recognize it, and they'd have to conform to the rules of the class they'd be designed for, which is I'm assuming Super Stock. At least that's what the Challenger and Mustang were built for. I still need to open up the new 2010 rulebook and see if power adders are legal in SS.

The Challenger Drag Pack is a pretty nice design, and only costs somewhere around 34k, whereas the Mustang CJ was around 75k I think. The big difference from what I heard was that Dodge will build one for you on a per order basis once they approve your application, whereas Ford is only building 50 CJs a year. The 2010 or 2011 Mustang is going to be a SCJ making even more power.

SteveR · 12-21-2009, 10:16 PM

I read today in the new Hot Rod that this isn't a special order car, you're just buying a bare frame for $7k, thats it. The article said several race teams were asking for it so they could build cars from the ground up without having to buy the whole car and have to tear it apart. That being the case, it will not be in competition with the Drag Pack Challengers and CJ Mustangs in that both the Challengers and Mustangs are factory built and backed race cars, these will be privately built. There is no talk of factory involvement in the article with any form of sanctioned racing with this.

BigAls87Z28 · 12-21-2009, 10:18 PM

Kinda glad. Sell the body in white stuff, and let it be.

SteveR · 12-21-2009, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigAls87Z28

Kinda glad. Sell the body in white stuff, and let it be.

Yea, I think it's a great idea. It makes the idea of a real home built ground up race car a bit more affordable if you're looking to run a new Camaro.

JL8Jeff · 12-22-2009, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveR

I read today in the new Hot Rod that this isn't a special order car, you're just buying a bare frame for $7k, thats it. The article said several race teams were asking for it so they could build cars from the ground up without having to buy the whole car and have to tear it apart. That being the case, it will not be in competition with the Drag Pack Challengers and CJ Mustangs in that both the Challengers and Mustangs are factory built and backed race cars, these will be privately built. There is no talk of factory involvement in the article with any form of sanctioned racing with this.

That article is several months old even though it just came out, the racers are working with GM now to build a complete "car" that will qualify for certain classes. I don't see how you could qualify a car without a VIN though.

Pampered-Z · 12-22-2009, 11:12 AM

As far as buying a body, this really isn't anything new, GM has sold just the bodies for years. The stock/Superstock class cars are built from this. Because every part of the car is gone over in such detail buying a complete car then tearing it apart and striping it down is just a waste of money. They just buy the body and add the parts you need for the class.