![Reply](http://www.njfboa.org/forums/images/buttons/reply.gif) |
02-09-2006, 11:34 PM
|
#1
|
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Long Branch, NJ
Posts: 333
|
Alm or steel fly?
Should I get an aluminum or steel SPEC flywheel? i dont know if my car has enough modifcations to justify an aluminum, i dont want it to run or drive like ****... and i'm also getting a carbon shaft and 4.10's so i think i;ll still need the weight of steel. anyone informed out there on the subject? i need to replace the stock one anyway, its in crappy shape... but i dont know whether to go stock, or spec steel/alum.
__________________
Current:
2002 Silver Metallic Kawasaki ZZR1200C1
Old:
2003 White Crown Vic P71 *sold*
1996 Burnt Red Metallic Trans Am M6 Ram/LE2/4.11 *sold*
2000 Silver Cougar V6 M5 *totalled haha*
1986 Black Cutlass Calais Coupe M5 *sold*
|
|
|
02-10-2006, 02:53 AM
|
#2
|
2007 Member of the Year
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Seabrook, TX
Posts: 14,281
|
Forgive me for asking but by carbon shaft i assume you mean carbon fiber driveshaft?
....why?
__________________
WF=DF
Kommandant of the ACL (Anti Canadian League)
Quote:
Originally Posted by LTb1ow
Junk the pos, spend the money on beer, acquire headache.
Same result cept this headache doesnt last months.
|
|
|
|
02-10-2006, 06:32 AM
|
#3
|
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hamilton SQ
Posts: 103
|
Whatever you decide buy an SFI approved flywheel.
Do your feet and car a favor and buy a Steel bellhousing like a LakeWood or a McLeod.
|
|
|
02-10-2006, 12:16 PM
|
#4
|
NJFBOA Co-Founder
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: All up in your kool aid!
Posts: 12,235
|
you don't want weight in the driveline or any other part of the car. go with the aluminum.
the concept of running a heavy flywheel is correct, for the first 15ft. after that you are just dragging around all the mass of steel to try to accelerate the car.
you will have to adjust your clutch release and launch RPM, but you will be quicker and faster with the aluminum flywheel.
|
|
|
02-10-2006, 01:51 PM
|
#5
|
Co-Founder / Site Admin
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Ewing, NJ
Posts: 22,473
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Savage_Messiah
Forgive me for asking but by carbon shaft i assume you mean carbon fiber driveshaft?
....why?
|
Because it only weighs 7 lbs
- Justin
__________________
1999 Camry - Beigemobile DD
2002 Suburban - Wife's DD
2004 Grand Cherokee - Not running / Project / Selling?
|
|
|
02-10-2006, 04:03 PM
|
#6
|
13 Second Club / Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Franklin Lakes, NJ
Posts: 8,684
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tru2Chevy
Because it only weighs 7 lbs
- Justin
|
and is damn strong
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by LS1ow
Except Jersey mike, great kid, but the way he looks at me makes me feel like im in danger
|
|
|
|
02-10-2006, 07:50 PM
|
#7
|
11 Second Club
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Hamilton Twp, NJ
Posts: 855
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJSPEEDER
you don't want weight in the driveline or any other part of the car. go with the aluminum.
the concept of running a heavy flywheel is correct, for the first 15ft. after that you are just dragging around all the mass of steel to try to accelerate the car.
you will have to adjust your clutch release and launch RPM, but you will be quicker and faster with the aluminum flywheel.
|
There was a real good article in one of the recent Car Craft or Hot Rod or Popular Hot Rodding mags that explained the physics of and it and then they backed it by using a 5.0 mustang that was running consistent high 10's and the results were pretty stout. I forget them exactly so I don't want to mislead, but the physics of it were very convincing and the proof was on the dragstrip. I tried searchin the web for the article, but no luck. If I can dig it up I'll forward a copy if you are interested....
Chris
__________________
1999 Formula 6spd (The driver)
1997 2500 Ext. Cab Dodge 4x4 CTD 5spd (The Earth Mover)
1970 Nova 5spd (The toy)
|
|
|
02-10-2006, 07:55 PM
|
#8
|
Admin.
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hamilton, NJ
Posts: 20,149
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1QWIKBIRD
There was a real good article in one of the recent Car Craft or Hot Rod or Popular Hot Rodding mags that explained the physics of and it and then they backed it by using a 5.0 mustang that was running consistent high 10's and the results were pretty stout. I forget them exactly so I don't want to mislead, but the physics of it were very convincing and the proof was on the dragstrip. I tried searchin the web for the article, but no luck. If I can dig it up I'll forward a copy if you are interested....
Chris
|
It was in PHR. The argument for a heavier flywheel is that it retains energy, but I believe they proved that some other attributes make up for the loss of knetic energy, so they believed the lightweight was the way to go.
__________________
Vent Windows Forever!
The looser the waistband, the deeper the quicksand. Or so I have read.
Feather-light suspension, Konis just couldn't hold. I'm so glad I took a look inside your showroom doors.
Hey everybody, it's good to have you on the Baba-too-da-ba-too-ba-ba-buh-doo-ga-ga-bop-a-dop
|
|
|
02-10-2006, 08:56 PM
|
#9
|
11 Second Club
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Hamilton Twp, NJ
Posts: 855
|
yeah that's the basic idea...the definitley recommended the lighter flywheel assuming you could compensate slightly with more rpm at launch...it's all about the moment of inertia....and the force required to overcome it....damn I have to find the artice, cause it was good, not only for clutch/flywheel speak, but for the entire driveline. One example they gave was the carbon fiber driveshaft....kind of a waste unless you are at the ragged edge and looking for every last ounce that's left, the reason being that the diameter of there drive shaft is small and there for the MOI is small, and you reach a point of diminishing returns. The flywheel on the other hand is 22-24 inches in diameter so the MOI is much higher as a function of the weight and its distance from the center of rotation....it's something along those lines.....
Chris
(frantically trying to find the article now)
__________________
1999 Formula 6spd (The driver)
1997 2500 Ext. Cab Dodge 4x4 CTD 5spd (The Earth Mover)
1970 Nova 5spd (The toy)
|
|
|
02-10-2006, 09:09 PM
|
#10
|
11 Second Club
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Hamilton Twp, NJ
Posts: 855
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by BonzoHansen
It was in PHR. The argument for a heavier flywheel is that it retains energy, but I believe they proved that some other attributes make up for the loss of knetic energy, so they believed the lightweight was the way to go.
|
Found the article, PHR February 2006.....The SPIN Zone.....definitely worth the read.....its talks about everthing on the driveline that is spinning/rotating from the balancer out to the rear wheels and tires....
Chris
__________________
1999 Formula 6spd (The driver)
1997 2500 Ext. Cab Dodge 4x4 CTD 5spd (The Earth Mover)
1970 Nova 5spd (The toy)
|
|
|
02-10-2006, 11:28 PM
|
#11
|
Banned Camp Director Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Somerset County
Posts: 8,395
|
and I was under the impression that a heavier flywheel would help in drag racing because it would help retain engine RPM between shifts. and an aluminum flywheel would be good for road racing because the RPM's cnage a lot so you would want the motor to speed up and slow down quicker.
I'm no scientist though!
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by baddest434
and 1 more smart ass answer by you and i'm going to reach into this monitor and grab you by the throat
|
|
|
|
02-11-2006, 09:08 AM
|
#12
|
NJFBOA Co-Founder
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: All up in your kool aid!
Posts: 12,235
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian
and I was under the impression that a heavier flywheel would help in drag racing because it would help retain engine RPM between shifts. and an aluminum flywheel would be good for road racing because the RPM's cnage a lot so you would want the motor to speed up and slow down quicker.
I'm no scientist though! ![Laughing](http://www.njfboa.org/forums/images/smilies/icon_lol.gif)
|
once you are ashifting the engine will fall to the RPM that matches the wheel speed regardless of flywheel weight. if a driver is spending enough time between gears that having all the inertia of the heavier wheels is important then that person could use more practice, not a heavier flywheel
|
|
|
02-11-2006, 07:23 PM
|
#13
|
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Orange County NY
Posts: 579
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJSPEEDER
you don't want weight in the driveline or any other part of the car. go with the aluminum.
the concept of running a heavy flywheel is correct, for the first 15ft. after that you are just dragging around all the mass of steel to try to accelerate the car.
you will have to adjust your clutch release and launch RPM, but you will be quicker and faster with the aluminum flywheel.
|
i have do disagre with you on this. If you dont have the turn momentum of the steel fly wheel to get a 3000# pound car out of the hole its gona hurt ur time. Ive seen a few cars boging bad with alum flywheels. Also for a side note HPE also recomended a steel flywheel
__________________
2000 Camaro 25.5 Turbo car ![Smile](http://www.njfboa.org/forums/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif) X275
|
|
|
02-12-2006, 10:59 AM
|
#14
|
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hamilton SQ
Posts: 103
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1984camaroz28
i have do disagre with you on this. If you dont have the turn momentum of the steel fly wheel to get a 3000# pound car out of the hole its gona hurt ur time. Ive seen a few cars boging bad with alum flywheels. Also for a side note HPE also recomended a steel flywheel
|
If the car is bogging its in the tune up, the clutch setup, the suspension setup, tire pressure, ect.
A stick car shouldnt leave like an Automatic. In low HP automatic car, the best launch is acheived through "dead hooking" the car.
While a stick car requires some wheelspin as its pitch rotating (on the launch) to build wheelspeed and not bog the motor.
Watch a well sorted out stick car leave the starting line, its pretty exciting, Steve Ficacci's A/Stick 68' Camaro comes to mind. This car is a pretty good example of what i'm talking about, the tires slip as its wheelstanding on the launch.
You cant fight the laws of physics and expect to go fast, simply put, the less rotating weight, the quicker it will accellerate.
In conclusion, slip the clutch or the tires, if this is a car racing on a Prepped track with good tires, if not then it will be tough to get it to hook with a slight tire spin. Instead they will give up, meaning they will spin uncontrollably and the car will slow down.
Street tires will definetly just Give up and spin uncontrolably, where-as the correct launch would be started with a 1/4 revolution of spin, then a slight "skipping" of the tire as it slips/hooks/slips/hooks while the car pitch rotates.
Last edited by BMF; 02-12-2006 at 11:30 AM.
|
|
|
02-12-2006, 11:05 AM
|
#15
|
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hamilton SQ
Posts: 103
|
BTW, car magazines are pretty much Useless, they're filled with bad information, wrong information, and biased information.
They're out there to advertise the "trick of the week" part, and that will bias the information in the articles to support buying the trick of the week part.
The best thing you can do with a car mag is throw it in the garbage.
Last edited by BMF; 02-12-2006 at 11:31 AM.
|
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
|
|
|