THE biggest online debate ever?

[Ian]

the statement says the plane is "standing" on a runway. my interperetation of standing is not moving.

[oh one ls1 SS]

This conveyer has a control system that tracks the plane speed and tunes the speed of the conveyer to be exactly the same (but in opposite direction).

the convayer moving one way and the wheels moving the other way cancel eachother out so the plane just sits there as the wheels and convayer are the only things moving which goes back to the tredmill concept

[GP99GT]

ok, heres one for you. take a model car, with wheels that roll, put it on a treadmill. theres no real engine in it to drive the WHEELS, so you have to push it with your hand to make it move forward on the treadmill. same concept as jet engines on a plane, they will push the plane forward, because the wheels are rolling free underneath the plane.

[Teds89IROC]

you're right, you need thrust and airflow. If the wheels of the plane were what was moving the plane across the ground in the first place, you would be correct, it would not take off. Being that the wheels only assist in moving the plane and are free rolling with no emphasis on direction, they have nothing to do with the thrust of the plane, they are negligable. Their only purpose is to fight friction and allow the plane to be moved, they don't push the plane.

~Ted

[oh one ls1 SS]

but once again it says that the convayer match's the speed of the plane's engins so how does it move?

[Ian]

Originally Posted by GP99GT

ok, heres one for you. take a model car, with wheels that roll, put it on a treadmill. theres no real engine in it to drive the WHEELS, so you have to push it with your hand to make it move forward on the treadmill. same concept as jet engines on a plane, they will push the plane forward, because the wheels are rolling free underneath the plane.

but in the statement it says that the tredmill will be going the exact speed of the plane, as soon as the plane creeps forward a centimeter, the tredmill starts and the plane stops moving forward.

[oh one ls1 SS]

i think Rob WS6 is just sittng back laughing at this

[Ian]

Originally Posted by Teds89IROC

you're right, you need thrust and airflow. If the wheels of the plane were what was moving the plane across the ground in the first place, you would be correct, it would not take off. Being that the wheels only assist in moving the plane and are free rolling with no emphasis on direction, they have nothing to do with the thrust of the plane, they are negligable. Their only purpose is to fight friction and allow the plane to be moved, they don't push the plane.

~Ted

please explain to me how the plane will move forward and get air to move across the wings. I'm dying to see this from your point of view.

[oh one ls1 SS]

DUDE!! because the wheels are moving DUHH!! haha

[Teds89IROC]

I think anyone with a brain is laughing at you and Ian

~Ted

[GP99GT]

no matter how fast the conveyor moves, there will still be the same minimal friction to stop the plane from moving, because it has wheels. thats the point of the wheels, so it can move freely using engine power.

[Teds89IROC]

I don't know how else to explain it, if you don;t understand it now, I guess you never will. THE WHEELS MOVE FREELY AND HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THE SPEED OF THE ACTUAL PLANE ON A CONVEYER MOVING IN THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION!!!!!

~Ted

[Ian]

Originally Posted by Teds89IROC

I think anyone with a brain is laughing at you and Ian

~Ted

Hey hey, no low shots. keep this focused on the question.

[oh one ls1 SS]

yes but it has to move foward on solid ground (or water) in orfer to get the airflow damn it!!

[Ian]

okay, so you're saying that the plane will move forward. You also say that the wheels dont matter at all. I understand that the wheels are designed to reduce friction for takeoff, but at the same time, they support the entire weight of the plane. I dont understand how it will remove the entire weight of the plane off the wheels while on a treadmill.

[oh one ls1 SS]

the wheels are just letting the plane sit there because there the only things moving in the wheels were locked up the plane will move backwards but since there free to spin there just letting the plane sit there... put rollerblades on a tredmill and turn it on whats going to happen if you do what the plane does... therotically speaking if you push foward on the rollerblade then the speed of the tredmill increases so your right back to where you started from

[GP99GT]

It will move forward, it will still be on the conveyor. theres no friction to move the plane backwards as the plane thrusts forward, because the jet engines are pushing the plane, not the wheels

[Ian]

OH!!!!! I understand what you mean now ted, but it still doesnt work because there is no airflow.

[oh one ls1 SS]

true but how does the air flow get factored in?? the plane needs to be moving

[GP99GT]

the plane will be moving, because the conveyor wont affect the thrust of hte plane, because theres no friction, because its rolling on wheels. end of discussion

[Ian]

If it was in a wind tunnel with air flowing over the wings, it would take off, but the question says its not in a wind tunnel so its not gonna take off.

[Ian]

there is ALWAYS friction! unless you're in a vacuum, there will always be friction. It takes lift to get the wheels off the ground, to get lift you need airflow. If you're starting from a dead standstill, the plane wont take off unless its in a wind tunnel.

[Ian]

I'll be back in a little bit, I have to go out to the ATM. keep up the debate, this is fun.

[GP99GT]

Originally Posted by Ian

there is ALWAYS friction! unless you're in a vacuum, there will always be friction. It takes lift to get the wheels off the ground, to get lift you need airflow. If you're starting from a dead standstill, the plane wont take off unless its in a wind tunnel.

ok theres a LITTLE friction, but minimal. the plane WILL be moving, there WILL be airflow. because it can roll, the conveyors speed will not change its ability to move forward using thrust.

[oh one ls1 SS]

im done with the debate 4 now i got Need 4 Speed to play i need to rice out my supra a little more!! hopefully we get some more people in on this