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11-27-2005, 11:27 PM
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#26
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Banned Camp Director Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Somerset County
Posts: 8,395
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the statement says the plane is "standing" on a runway. my interperetation of standing is not moving.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baddest434
and 1 more smart ass answer by you and i'm going to reach into this monitor and grab you by the throat
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11-27-2005, 11:28 PM
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#27
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Edison
Posts: 2,363
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This conveyer has a control system that tracks the plane speed and tunes the speed of the conveyer to be exactly the same (but in opposite direction).
the convayer moving one way and the wheels moving the other way cancel eachother out so the plane just sits there as the wheels and convayer are the only things moving which goes back to the tredmill concept
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11-27-2005, 11:29 PM
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#28
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Mr Fantastic
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: West Milford NJ
Posts: 7,917
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ok, heres one for you. take a model car, with wheels that roll, put it on a treadmill. theres no real engine in it to drive the WHEELS, so you have to push it with your hand to make it move forward on the treadmill. same concept as jet engines on a plane, they will push the plane forward, because the wheels are rolling free underneath the plane.
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Matt
B18B1 FTW
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11-27-2005, 11:30 PM
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#29
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Haledon, NJ
Posts: 5,162
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you're right, you need thrust and airflow. If the wheels of the plane were what was moving the plane across the ground in the first place, you would be correct, it would not take off. Being that the wheels only assist in moving the plane and are free rolling with no emphasis on direction, they have nothing to do with the thrust of the plane, they are negligable. Their only purpose is to fight friction and allow the plane to be moved, they don't push the plane.
~Ted
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1989 IROC-Z 355 LT1 T56 Swapped
2016 Chevy Colorado LT 3.6 v6
2008 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo 4.7L RIP 12/29/2016
1998 Honda CBR 600F3
2003 Yamaha FX140
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11-27-2005, 11:30 PM
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#30
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Edison
Posts: 2,363
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but once again it says that the convayer match's the speed of the plane's engins so how does it move?
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11-27-2005, 11:31 PM
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#31
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Banned Camp Director Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Somerset County
Posts: 8,395
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GP99GT
ok, heres one for you. take a model car, with wheels that roll, put it on a treadmill. theres no real engine in it to drive the WHEELS, so you have to push it with your hand to make it move forward on the treadmill. same concept as jet engines on a plane, they will push the plane forward, because the wheels are rolling free underneath the plane.
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but in the statement it says that the tredmill will be going the exact speed of the plane, as soon as the plane creeps forward a centimeter, the tredmill starts and the plane stops moving forward.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baddest434
and 1 more smart ass answer by you and i'm going to reach into this monitor and grab you by the throat
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11-27-2005, 11:32 PM
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#32
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Edison
Posts: 2,363
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i think Rob WS6 is just sittng back laughing at this
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11-27-2005, 11:32 PM
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#33
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Banned Camp Director Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Somerset County
Posts: 8,395
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teds89IROC
you're right, you need thrust and airflow. If the wheels of the plane were what was moving the plane across the ground in the first place, you would be correct, it would not take off. Being that the wheels only assist in moving the plane and are free rolling with no emphasis on direction, they have nothing to do with the thrust of the plane, they are negligable. Their only purpose is to fight friction and allow the plane to be moved, they don't push the plane.
~Ted
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please explain to me how the plane will move forward and get air to move across the wings. I'm dying to see this from your point of view.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baddest434
and 1 more smart ass answer by you and i'm going to reach into this monitor and grab you by the throat
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11-27-2005, 11:33 PM
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#34
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Edison
Posts: 2,363
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DUDE!! because the wheels are moving DUHH!! haha
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11-27-2005, 11:33 PM
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#35
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Haledon, NJ
Posts: 5,162
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I think anyone with a brain is laughing at you and Ian
~Ted
__________________
1989 IROC-Z 355 LT1 T56 Swapped
2016 Chevy Colorado LT 3.6 v6
2008 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo 4.7L RIP 12/29/2016
1998 Honda CBR 600F3
2003 Yamaha FX140
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11-27-2005, 11:33 PM
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#36
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Mr Fantastic
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: West Milford NJ
Posts: 7,917
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no matter how fast the conveyor moves, there will still be the same minimal friction to stop the plane from moving, because it has wheels. thats the point of the wheels, so it can move freely using engine power.
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Matt
B18B1 FTW
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11-27-2005, 11:34 PM
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#37
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Haledon, NJ
Posts: 5,162
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I don't know how else to explain it, if you don;t understand it now, I guess you never will. THE WHEELS MOVE FREELY AND HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THE SPEED OF THE ACTUAL PLANE ON A CONVEYER MOVING IN THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION!!!!!
~Ted
__________________
1989 IROC-Z 355 LT1 T56 Swapped
2016 Chevy Colorado LT 3.6 v6
2008 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo 4.7L RIP 12/29/2016
1998 Honda CBR 600F3
2003 Yamaha FX140
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11-27-2005, 11:35 PM
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#38
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Banned Camp Director Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Somerset County
Posts: 8,395
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teds89IROC
I think anyone with a brain is laughing at you and Ian
~Ted
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Hey hey, no low shots. keep this focused on the question.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by baddest434
and 1 more smart ass answer by you and i'm going to reach into this monitor and grab you by the throat
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11-27-2005, 11:35 PM
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#39
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Edison
Posts: 2,363
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yes but it has to move foward on solid ground (or water) in orfer to get the airflow damn it!!
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11-27-2005, 11:37 PM
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#40
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Banned Camp Director Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Somerset County
Posts: 8,395
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okay, so you're saying that the plane will move forward. You also say that the wheels dont matter at all. I understand that the wheels are designed to reduce friction for takeoff, but at the same time, they support the entire weight of the plane. I dont understand how it will remove the entire weight of the plane off the wheels while on a treadmill.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by baddest434
and 1 more smart ass answer by you and i'm going to reach into this monitor and grab you by the throat
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11-27-2005, 11:37 PM
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#41
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Edison
Posts: 2,363
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the wheels are just letting the plane sit there because there the only things moving in the wheels were locked up the plane will move backwards but since there free to spin there just letting the plane sit there... put rollerblades on a tredmill and turn it on whats going to happen if you do what the plane does... therotically speaking if you push foward on the rollerblade then the speed of the tredmill increases so your right back to where you started from
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11-27-2005, 11:37 PM
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#42
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Mr Fantastic
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: West Milford NJ
Posts: 7,917
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It will move forward, it will still be on the conveyor. theres no friction to move the plane backwards as the plane thrusts forward, because the jet engines are pushing the plane, not the wheels
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Matt
B18B1 FTW
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11-27-2005, 11:38 PM
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#43
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Banned Camp Director Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Somerset County
Posts: 8,395
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OH!!!!! I understand what you mean now ted, but it still doesnt work because there is no airflow.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by baddest434
and 1 more smart ass answer by you and i'm going to reach into this monitor and grab you by the throat
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11-27-2005, 11:39 PM
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#44
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Edison
Posts: 2,363
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true but how does the air flow get factored in?? the plane needs to be moving
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11-27-2005, 11:40 PM
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#45
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Mr Fantastic
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: West Milford NJ
Posts: 7,917
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the plane will be moving, because the conveyor wont affect the thrust of hte plane, because theres no friction, because its rolling on wheels. end of discussion
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Matt
B18B1 FTW
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11-27-2005, 11:40 PM
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#46
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Banned Camp Director Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Somerset County
Posts: 8,395
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If it was in a wind tunnel with air flowing over the wings, it would take off, but the question says its not in a wind tunnel so its not gonna take off.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by baddest434
and 1 more smart ass answer by you and i'm going to reach into this monitor and grab you by the throat
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11-27-2005, 11:42 PM
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#47
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Banned Camp Director Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Somerset County
Posts: 8,395
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there is ALWAYS friction! unless you're in a vacuum, there will always be friction. It takes lift to get the wheels off the ground, to get lift you need airflow. If you're starting from a dead standstill, the plane wont take off unless its in a wind tunnel.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by baddest434
and 1 more smart ass answer by you and i'm going to reach into this monitor and grab you by the throat
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11-27-2005, 11:43 PM
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#48
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Banned Camp Director Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Somerset County
Posts: 8,395
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I'll be back in a little bit, I have to go out to the ATM. keep up the debate, this is fun.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by baddest434
and 1 more smart ass answer by you and i'm going to reach into this monitor and grab you by the throat
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11-27-2005, 11:44 PM
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#49
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Mr Fantastic
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: West Milford NJ
Posts: 7,917
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian
there is ALWAYS friction! unless you're in a vacuum, there will always be friction. It takes lift to get the wheels off the ground, to get lift you need airflow. If you're starting from a dead standstill, the plane wont take off unless its in a wind tunnel.
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ok theres a LITTLE friction, but minimal. the plane WILL be moving, there WILL be airflow. because it can roll, the conveyors speed will not change its ability to move forward using thrust.
__________________
Matt
B18B1 FTW
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11-27-2005, 11:44 PM
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#50
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Edison
Posts: 2,363
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im done with the debate 4 now i got Need 4 Speed to play i need to rice out my supra a little more!! hopefully we get some more people in on this
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