Car troubles, need help

[BullittSVT]

Hello all, my 98 3.8 has been giving me some problems in the past week. Two weeks ago I got a PO410 code from a check engine light that popped up out of no where, this coincides with rattling noises I hear under my car - mid car. The C-E-L turns off a few days later.. Last Saturday while driving, my car shutters and my throttle drops and I lose speed, then complete control of the car - it dies and I lose steering. Car won't start, so I pop the hood and place a battery cable back that was a little loose and it starts right up and drives me home.

Fast forward to that night, car won't start after driving to a party. Gets towed and I get a parking ticket...

I get the car back, same problem as before.. real shutter and the car dies on me while driving it back from dinner. Not a battery cable and it took awhile to get going, have to let it sit for a bit. Oil pressure normal, temperature normal..

- My temperature did shoot up after it died when idling - near 210

Take it to a mechanic and he says its the fuel filter (I'm thinking to myself, bull s***) because he and my step dad when driving the car never had it die on them. Ok, the fuel filter is replaced and I drive it home. Starts an hour later and dies 10 feet away.

Suggestions on what may be causing my troubles?

EDIT 5/22 - CEL back on, PO420 Code

[Green_Phoenix_LT1]

P0410 Is a seconday air injection system malfunction. AIR pump is either bad or the fuse is blown, replace fuse to start with should solve your CEL issue.

Is that the only code that comes up when you scan it?

[BullittSVT]

Yeah, that was the only code. The CEL isn't on anymore though, would an air pump kill a car like that?

[Green_Phoenix_LT1]

I wouldnt think so but Im no mechanic lol. And dont have much experience on the 3.8L yet. I would also maybe check the ICM/Coils/Plugs/Wires. Could be an ignition issue.

[BullittSVT]

I don't think it's an "air pump", ignition maybe - it was a little more difficult to start if I didn't turn the key harder and faster

But then again, don't think that would kill my car WHILE driving

[JL8Jeff]

The air pump might share a circuit with something else and therefore shut down something else when it acts up. Did you have it scanned for any other hidden codes? Do you hear the air pump turn on when you first start the car? If not, it might be siezed up and putting a load on the system. If you don't hear it, try disconnecting the wiring to it. It might trigger a code but the car should run like normal. On my old 93, one of the AIR check valves went bad and let hot exhaust go back into the AIR lines and in winter that allowed condensation to build up. It eventually filled the AIR pump with water and froze solid one morning and took out the fuse. Did you also check the battery to make sure the terminals weren't about to rot out? The AC Delco batteries are known for the terminals rotting from the inside out and will eventually break off.

[BullittSVT]

Battery terminals are fine, I didn't have it scanned for any other codes. I'll take a look at the AIR pump

[MyFirstZ]

need to clarify a few thing. When it dies is it when you are pulling away or coming to a stop. when it starts is it trying to crank just not firing.

just from what I am reading my first try would be the fuel pressure regulator.

[BullittSVT]

It's died twice while cruising at 50~
and it's died once while pulling from a dead stop after starting it up

It trys to crank but it doesn't fire, I get the heavy smell of gasoline after going at it for a little bit

One of my coil pack wires #3 is a little damaged,a little piece of the rubber is chipped off.. might be nothing though

[MyFirstZ]

I would try a regulator. Cheap and easy

i doubt the spark plug wire is arcing if it is only a little and no copper. but a tune up never will hurt a car

unless you beat your car aftercause it is ia bitch to do on those 6 cyl

let me know what you find, il try and be as helpful as possbile

[MyFirstZ]

Curious what they charged for that job to. . to do the fuel filter

[sweetbmxrider]

When the car dies and just cranks, pull some plug wires and see if they spark. Could be something like a crank position sensor ****ting out but its really tough to say right now.

[MyFirstZ]

I would imagine you would get a timing fault or something similar if it was that. That is why I say start with fuel since they won't through a fault. maybe some leans faults if you get lucky

[BullittSVT]

Originally Posted by MyFirstZ

Curious what they charged for that job to. . to do the fuel filter

fuel filter costed me 100 installed..

[MyFirstZ]

Ok not bad

[BullittSVT]

Check engine light came on, doubting I can make it to autozone...

[BullittSVT]

Whoops.. misread the code, It's a PO420 Code

A "Catalyst efficiency low bank 1"

Oxygen sensors monitor the Catalytic Converters ability to store oxygen
Cause: Catalytic converter defective
Engine Misfire or running condition
Large vacuum leak
Engine oil leakage into exhaust valve guide seals/piston rings

Any new ideas? Not a Po410 code

[Blacdout96]

Tell me you didn't get teh fuel filter job done yet 100 bucks?! that's rediculous, it's right there, shouldn't take more then 10 minutes to change. Also it sounds liek a crank/cam, or ignition control module problem. I got a spare module somewhere if you want to throw that on, see if it'll screw up. Also have cam/crank sensors laying somewhere as well, but taking the crank pulley off to get to it it's a bit of a pain when the engine is still in the car lol.

[MyFirstZ]

As easy as it is to do the fuel filter he brought it to a shop and looks like he paid about half hour labor maybe a little more and the mark up on the fuel filter. If i were to do it i would have charged around 70-100 also.

With the long crank, the dieing while driving and pulling away i would put money on that regulator and an 02 fault that sounds like it is to lean. Besides the fact that it somewhat common.

[WildBillyT]

Originally Posted by BullittSVT

Whoops.. misread the code, It's a PO420 Code



Any new ideas? Not a Po410 code

That code is for a catalytic converter or rear O2 sensor that is not operating properly.

[MyFirstZ]

Catalyst effieciency does not mean the o2 sensor is not operating correctly. Cat effiecieny means something before the o2 is not correct. The sensor is doing what it should be and picking up a problem with the mixture.

I have only ever seen a 02 sensors fail for the heater circuit or if there was no other problems that can be found in the car. But in his case the car is stalling.

[WildBillyT]

Originally Posted by MyFirstZ

Catalyst effieciency does not mean the o2 sensor is not operating correctly. Cat effiecieny means something before the o2 is not correct. The sensor is doing what it should be and picking up a problem with the mixture.

I have only ever seen a 02 sensors fail for the heater circuit or if there was no other problems that can be found in the car. But in his case the car is stalling.

Just spitballing here. So what would the symptoms of a "clogged" cat be? Due to the rattle, loss of power, and 420 code that's where I was thinking he might want to look.

[MyFirstZ]

actually didnt see the "cat or o2" though it jsut said o2... i apologize.

Thats true. But generally with a clogged cat you will just feel it chocking at higher rpms not so much at idle. Never seen it stall out a car.

Might be two different problems.

[Stevoone]

Had a car die on me from a clogged cat. Took it for a test drive, got around the block and it bogged then stalled. Ended up getting it towed back to the shop because it wouldn't restart.

I haven't seen one cause a no-start when cold tho.

I would check backpressure readings before you replace anything. Also check fuel pressure and spark as mentioned above.

I've had a lot of issues with MAF sensors on 3.8's but they were all FWD (grand prix and bonnevilles). Not sure if it's the same setup.

[jam01]

just a suggestion, but have you checked your air filter. my nephews truck was doing the same thing, it was probably never changed in his case. it had rust on the metal and enough dirt to plant flowers. also next time it does this look at the cat and see if is glowing, that is always a sign of a clogged cat.