Engine Suggestion ?

[BluMaj24]

Quick question which I know will probably be turned into flaming...

My friend recently acquired an LT1 shortblock for free and is willing to give it to me for my 87 IROC project. Now originally I was looking for an LS1 setup, but know the LT1 is a stronger motor and can be faster once opened up. I have a daily driver, so the IROC is going to be a fun and fast weekend/track car. I intend on it being a 10 second car, or possibly a little faster (maybe mid-high 9's).

Should I take the free Shortblock and do my research on that and build it up (Heads, Cam, Stronger Pistons, etc.) or keep looking for an LS1 that'll probably run me a good 2000 - $3000 for a stocker/lightly modded longblock. My theory is that since the LT1 bolts up easier anyway, and is an iron block vs. aluminum, it might be a better setup. I just don't want to go the cheaper route and end up unhappy, but if the cheaper route is the same or a little better anyway...might as well.

[V]

i think an LS1 would be the easiest to modify for the type of perfromance you are looking for plus you'll be saving weight. I have dealt with both LT1s and LS1s and now i would always prefer an LS1. To me they just seem much more simple, no costly/problematic opti and such.

I was selling a new LS1 block with a ton of stuff(crank, 15 rods &pistons, 2 sets heads, 2 cams etc) for 2,000. Currently i have someone interested in the shortblock parts so thats why i said "was" selling. but if that falls through ill let you know if you wish.

[foff667]

Originally Posted by SmokingSS

i think an LS1 would be the easiest to modify for the type of perfromance you are looking for plus you'll be saving weight. I have dealt with both LT1s and LS1s and now i would always prefer an LS1. To me they just seem much more simple, no costly/problematic opti and such.

[Tru2Chevy]

Yea, I would say that the LS1, while costing more up front, will be better for you in the long run.

If the shortblock is free, grab it anyway, and sell it to make some money to put towards the LS1.

- Justin

[BluMaj24]

Now the LS1 requires more custom stuff for mounting and such...Engine mounts, reloaction bracket, etc...that's still easier?

From what I understand, the LS1's aluminum is lighter and quicker stock, but LT1 can be faster modded and is a little tougher because it's Iron. At some point the motor may be blown and/or sprayed...but not immidiately.

My planning is to basically build the motor/trans from the get-go and hopefully not have to tear it apart again (Given all holds up...but since when does a track day goes by when you don't break something, lol). At the start, lookin for 11's all motor/bolt on.

For the 87 IROC, this is what I'm thinking of at the moment...
Engine: LT1 bored .60over made to 408 or LS1 bored .30over
Trans: TH400 w/ High Stall TC most likely, maybe T56 manual but it depends how much power.
Rear: Moser 9"
Gears: 4.10's
Heads: Stg 2/3 Aluminum heads
Cam: (not specific on the Cam yet, mild-high)
Pistons: Forged Pistons
Exhaust: True Duals
Headers: Hooker/Pace - again, not specific as of yet.
Intake: Not sure what hooks to LT1, but was looking at LS6 intake if LS1 motor.
Ignition: MSD Ignition

Like I said, I want to do it right from the begining so any input would be greatly appreciated. This is going to be a long project...starting with motor then working outward. My plan is to buy everything at once when I save all the money, but I'm sure deals will arise and I'll buy parts along the way...but not buying a single part until I determine which motor.

[V]

i'd recommend a stock LS1 block, std. bore. an ls1 can only be bored .10 over before having to be resleeved which get expensive, and with the LT1, i wouldn't run much boost on it .60 over(thats just me).

the LS1 is a very tough motor, i wouldnt doubt the aluminum or make iron vs. aluminum an issue. Many spray and have supercharger setups on stock bottom end without many concerns, if you upgrade to better internals, itll be just as strong as a built lt1.

As for an LS1 build, i'd suggest stock displacement(346cu. in.) and go with a serious heads/cam package, throw on an LS6 intake and you'll be in the 11's with a proper suspension setup.


True duals arent really a viable option on a 3rd gen, its do-able but theres no need. An 500hp LS1 can easily make due with a single 3" catback.

Also since it'll be custom and so on, tuning an LS1 would be much easier.

[WildBillyT]

Originally Posted by BluMaj24

Now the LS1 requires more custom stuff for mounting and such...Engine mounts, reloaction bracket, etc...that's still easier?

From what I understand, the LS1's aluminum is lighter and quicker stock, but LT1 can be faster modded and is a little tougher because it's Iron. At some point the motor may be blown and/or sprayed...but not immidiately.

My planning is to basically build the motor/trans from the get-go and hopefully not have to tear it apart again (Given all holds up...but since when does a track day goes by when you don't break something, lol). At the start, lookin for 11's all motor/bolt on.

For the 87 IROC, this is what I'm thinking of at the moment...
Engine: LT1 bored .60over made to 408 or LS1 bored .30over
Trans: TH400 w/ High Stall TC most likely, maybe T56 manual but it depends how much power.
Rear: Moser 9"
Gears: 4.10's
Heads: Stg 2/3 Aluminum heads
Cam: (not specific on the Cam yet, mild-high)
Pistons: Forged Pistons
Exhaust: True Duals
Headers: Hooker/Pace - again, not specific as of yet.
Intake: Not sure what hooks to LT1, but was looking at LS6 intake if LS1 motor.
Ignition: MSD Ignition

Like I said, I want to do it right from the begining so any input would be greatly appreciated. This is going to be a long project...starting with motor then working outward. My plan is to buy everything at once when I save all the money, but I'm sure deals will arise and I'll buy parts along the way...but not buying a single part until I determine which motor.

If you don't already know, .060 over in an LT1 won't give you a 408. Also, most LT1s were two bolt main motors- I'd convert it to a 4 bolt if you are going for serious power.

[V]

LS1s have 6 bolt mains, lol

[qwikz28]

Originally Posted by SmokingSS

LS1s have 6 bolt mains, lol

Thank God!!!! lol

i will also vote LS1 (biasedly of course) because of their aftermarket potential. there are many new products coming out almost daily for that motor, can you say the same for an LT1? newer technology is also a plus. its up to you though.

[z28c4maro82z]

Hey all I'm the friend that got the motor for my friend. IMO you can't go wrong with the LT1 motor in the 3rd Gen. I mean from my very simple research I am finding 396 stroker kits for 1800-2200 bucks. I see fully assembled LS1 402 or 408 stroker motors fully assembled for 8000-12000 bucks. You have to remember this is a budgeted project. 2200 bucks for a 396 stoker kit+cost of boring the block + cost of assembling the block. I see it being more cost effective way to make the power and go the speed wanted by my friend Dave. From what I have seen the LT1 motor drops right in and bolts right up. The LS1 motor you would need a good amount of custom fabrication, and custom mounts and kmember. Just a lot of extra work. I mean give us some input on this just look at it with an open UNBIASED mind please.

PS--I myself have a 2000 z28 LS1 lol so I too wanted to say LS1, but this fell in my lap

[Pampered-Z]

Originally Posted by z28c4maro82z

Hey all I'm the friend that got the motor for my friend. IMO you can't go wrong with the LT1 motor in the 3rd Gen. I mean from my very simple research I am finding 396 stroker kits for 1800-2200 bucks. I see fully assembled LS1 402 or 408 stroker motors fully assembled for 8000-12000 bucks. You have to remember this is a budgeted project. 2200 bucks for a 396 stoker kit+cost of boring the block + cost of assembling the block. I see it being more cost effective way to make the power and go the speed wanted by my friend Dave. From what I have seen the LT1 motor drops right in and bolts right up. The LS1 motor you would need a good amount of custom fabrication, and custom mounts and kmember. Just a lot of extra work. I mean give us some input on this just look at it with an open UNBIASED mind please.

PS--I myself have a 2000 z28 LS1 lol so I too wanted to say LS1, but this fell in my lap

OK, well then this is allot different then the first post that said,,,

Originally Posted by BluMaj24

, But know the LT1 is a stronger motor and can be faster once opened up. .

Originally Posted by BluMaj24

I intend on it being a 10 second car, or possibly a little faster (maybe mid-high 9's)..

Originally Posted by BluMaj24

I just don't want to go the cheaper route and end up unhappy, but if the cheaper route is the same or a little better anyway...might as well.

Based on those statements 99% including me ( And I am an LT1 guy ) are going to say the LS1 motor will make the power (plus the reduced weight ). So the LS1 would be a better way to go.

For a real buget upgrade into a 3rd gen, well if you have the LT1 motor then use it!

Now, making a 396 LT1 motor is going to cost more, allot more then $2,200. Sounds like You compared a LT1 kit ( probably rotating assembly ) to a complete LS1 motor. I complete 396 LT1 stroker is probably only slightly less then a complete LS1 stroker ( I'm thinking simple boring versus resleeving?).

Even if you get an LT1 shortblock (rotating assembly AND block prep for $2,200 ( which seems real low! ), you'll need head work, stock heads aren't going to flow enough to feed 396CI, nor is the valve train good enough, Cam, springs, rockers, probably lifters, and you also need injectors and of course tuning etc. I would put a low budget 396 LT1 more in the $6,000 range.

Budget 10's with an LT1 in a 3rd gen? Hum, Sure sounds like a fun idea. What about just putting stronger pistons in it, upgrading the valve train and then hitting it with a 125-150 shot of nitris and hope the drive train holds together for 10 seconds! And you will probably need the expert hand of NJSpeeder to take a few hun. pounds out of the car too.


Keep us posted.

JB

[BluMaj24]

Might be able to get my hands on an LS1 shorty for 300 - $500...from the sounds of it, that's where I should look.

The LT1 block was free, but the more I research it - the more it seems that even S/c'd or Sprayed it still doesn't make the LS1 power (not to mention weight). I figure making a forged LS1 block should be just as strong as a forged LT1 block.

Will keep yas posted as I do more research.

[V]

an ls1 shortblock for 500? good luck. if you can, itll most likely have issues, piston slap, oil consumption, damaged piston etc...

[z28c4maro82z]

Well, the shortblock I may have found has 109k on it, and has some knicks on top a few pistons. Again it isn't going to be a block designed for running stock. Probably build the block before it gets dumped in the car. Oh yeah it has Katech rods in it too so a bit of a start. 300 bucks for the shortblock, but it will need a rebuild. Well not NEED, but is strongly recommended

[BluMaj24]

Pistons were to be replaced anyway, and 109k on the block doesn't mean much since all internals are being replaced anyway. As long as the block isn't compromised, I think I may do it.

$300 seems like a worthwhile expenditure as I've seen LS1 cam only cars with bolt ons (Z28c4maro82z) putting out 420whp/390wtrq. Hell, I've seen LS1 cars with mild mods running low 12's, high 11's on a stock block. From what I've been finding in my research, LT1's built and with FI are putting out maybe 460whp. It just seems like the LS1 would be easier to get to the numbers I want, although more of a pain in the ass to get into the 3rd gen.

[njfastestcamaro]

if u want to sell that lt-1 block i will buy it