Oil in the Anti-Freeze - NJFBOA - Home of New Jersey's Camaros and Firebirds

ar0ck · 04-01-2006, 10:36 PM

So I discovered a bit of Oil in my Anti-Freeze when I was checking the fluids the other day. This obviously means that Head Gasket failure is near. What are some tall tale signs that it has failed, or things to look for to catch it? If the gasket blows what kind of damage can happen to the rest of the motor? What would be the end result? What kind of go fast goodies could I sneak in while its apart?

It defenitly does not sound like fun on an LT1, and I want to start saving my money to get it fixed asap and get it back on the road as fast as possible.

Savage_Messiah · 04-02-2006, 12:38 AM

get some aftermarket heads now... and a cam while you're at it. And all the other little things tht go with them of course.

Tru2Chevy · 04-02-2006, 12:16 PM

Well, if there is already oil in the coolant, I'd say it's a telltale sign that a gasket has already blown.

Ported heads, cam, maybe freshen the shortblock while it's down?

- Justin

V · 04-02-2006, 12:21 PM

just one thing, are you sure its engine oil? not like trans fluid, or steering fluid. i know LS1s sometimes have an issue with the power steering cooler.

Ian · 04-02-2006, 04:41 PM

since the heads and intake have to come off, might as well get them port matched and hogged out. and since all that stuff will be off, you could sneak a CC306 cam in there

Imagine how that would sound through the cutout

Oh, and to answer the other part of your question. If the head gasket lets go completely, you might hydrolock the motor and bend/break your rods and crank, and that would F up the block. so you should get that fixed pronto!

12secondv6 · 04-02-2006, 10:46 PM

Do NOT spray!

coldkilla · 04-03-2006, 06:07 AM

i wouldnt do any full throttle blasts either, take it easy and slow. you dont want to blow it out completely.

johnjzjz · 04-03-2006, 08:41 AM

If you can pressure test the radiator with a pump type tool, pump it up to 17 / 18 lbs with car motor warm and spark plugs out, let it sit 10 min, check pressure and if down ! re pump it up, do this twice if it goes down fast 3 times if it goes down very slow, ( pressure that is ) from pumping up the radiator, after 1/2 hour of doing this and letting it sit now crank over motor with starter if raw water ( anti freeze ) comes out of any of the spark plug holes, you will than know what cylinder is the problem, and raw water not always, but could be a crack in the head or a cylinder sleave, if you do the job yourself make note, the gasket is the key in knowing, try your best not to wreck it, reading it is the way to know for sure, and if its bad have the head decked if it is a gasket problem ( is the cause ) jz owner Z Bros Racing 68 super gas nova 78 f body super street NHRA Divisional racing

Scorched SS · 04-03-2006, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmokingSS

just one thing, are you sure its engine oil? not like trans fluid, or steering fluid. i know LS1s sometimes have an issue with the power steering cooler.

Thats the truth - are there any other coolers running through the hoses on the LT1? Ive gone thru 2 power steering coolers that gave me the same problem that you're having.

V · 04-03-2006, 11:15 AM

i dont think the lt1s have the power steering pipe cooler thing, now that i think of it, i doubt its that, and since his car is manual, that rules out an issue with trans fluid through the rad. Basically all thats left is engine oil.

When i put the new motor in my SS, i will probably go to a seperate power steering cooler to eliminate any possible future problems.

Ian · 04-03-2006, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnjzjz

If you can pressure test the radiator with a pump type tool, pump it up to 17 / 18 lbs with car motor warm and spark plugs out, let it sit 10 min, check pressure and if down ! re pump it up, do this twice if it goes down fast 3 times if it goes down very slow, ( pressure that is ) from pumping up the radiator, after 1/2 hour of doing this and letting it sit now crank over motor with starter if raw water ( anti freeze ) comes out of any of the spark plug holes, you will than know what cylinder is the problem, and raw water not always, but could be a crack in the head or a cylinder sleave, if you do the job yourself make note, the gasket is the key in knowing, try your best not to wreck it, reading it is the way to know for sure, and if its bad have the head decked if it is a gasket problem ( is the cause ) jz owner Z Bros Racing 68 super gas nova 78 f body super street NHRA Divisional racing

VERY good advice. and I'll second trying to keep the gasket intact so you can try and figure out if its the gasket or the head/block.

Teds89IROC · 04-03-2006, 11:46 PM

Ah yes, my final sign was my stock car sounded like it had a cam

This was while I was out, so I tried to get back home. The car barely started and as I drove up the hill, it looked like a scene from Joe Dirt, I've never seen so much white smoke come out of anyones exhaust, let alone anything

I was visiting my grandma at the nursing home and I remember while I was driving away there were 2 girls walking and as I passed they both were waving their arms in front of their faces while coughing

But yea, all the coolant got blown through the exhaust

~Ted

IROCZBeast · 04-05-2006, 05:48 PM

1.6 RR's

Pampered-Z · 04-10-2006, 09:48 AM

I agree with johnJZJZ to do a pressure test first. Another thing is to run the engine with the cap off and rev it and look for bubbles.

How much oil are you talking about. it is just a slight film floating on top? That does happen if the coolant is old, over time as the rubber in the hoses deteriorate and the coolant breaks down you can see these oils in the coolant.

It looks like we may finally be staying above freezing. Consider flushing the cooland system very thoroughly and running just water and see if the oil returns?

How many miles are on the engine? what is it's condition ( how hard do you drive it? ) If the motor is tired you should think about a total rebuild, adding hi-po parts will only add stress to older worn parts. Put in a free reving cam etc. will only lead to a lower end failure. Spun bearings are common. If you add a cam to a engine with a worn bottom end/ oil pump your olny going to hurt it quickly.

If you feel your bottom end is up to it, when you tear the motor down and your on a budget there are a few upgrades you can do.

Felpro .039 head gaskets will raise your compression .5

The hotcam kit is probably one of the best bang for your buck upgrades as you get the cam, valve springs and 1.6 rockers, Should yeild in the 325-345 HP with headers and tuning and will still pass emmissions.

Just understand that tearing into an LT1 motor does get exspenvise because you start also replacing worn parts. Got the Opti off, might as well replace it - $300, and the water pump - $100 - 200 ( upgrade ? good time to go electric pump ), Timing chain probably worn, More "Cha-ching" Unlike the old blocks, parts aint cheap on these motors!

I would say that if you have between 50-75K on the engine and it is in good shape, doing no Opti/W.P replacment parts and a cam install will run $600 - $1,000. If 75-100K - $1,000 - $1,300. Over that or if your hard on the car rebuild the whole thing.

I'm getting ready to do 2 LT1 cam installs and I'm creating the "parts list". One is a mild cam, other is more aggressive and will include a double roller timing chain and electric water pump. So if you decide you need to tear the engine down I can give you some good ideas on different mods and what they cost.

JB

JL8Jeff · 04-10-2006, 10:11 AM

Does your car have the engine oil cooler option? If so, maybe it's related to that. Do you see any sign of coolant in the oil? That's when the real trouble starts.

ar0ck · 04-10-2006, 11:32 PM

To answer Pampered-Z it was a light layer on the anti-freeze dip-stick. It defenitly looks like it should be flushed, maybe I should defenitly try that first before i jump to major conclusions. The motor has 106,000 miles on it, the trans only has about 5k. Ive always wanted to do a hot cam, and I already have a new water-pump & opti set up so I should defenitly look into a rebuild. I just cant decide what I want to do yet. The re-sale value of LT1's is pathetic these days

Plus my car is going to be a project car for work in a month or so & Id hate to test and abuse it and have the motor pop on me un-expected! My major problem is the potential down-time, thats why ive been thinking of a spare motor with a tubular front end to just swap straight in!

Quote:

Originally Posted by JL8Jeff

Does your car have the engine oil cooler option? If so, maybe it's related to that. Do you see any sign of coolant in the oil? That's when the real trouble starts.

Nope, my car didn't get the oil cooler.

Pampered-Z · 04-11-2006, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TransAm4Life

To answer Pampered-Z it was a light layer on the anti-freeze dip-stick.

I would not be as concerned with the overflow can as I would if you saw it when you took the radiator cap and seen it in there. Any oils or whatever that float to the top of the radiator are getting sucked into the Overflow and being trapped. So after the years and 100K miles I'm sure there will be some stuff in there. I'd bet your motor is fine, but you are due for a flush!

I would flush the system and remove the overflow and clean it thoroughly. It's part of the battery tray, I think it's held in with 2-3 bolts. Then refill and monitor, but I think your okay.

( More quick, cheap mods - while your flushing the system it's a good time to do the throttle body bypass and a 160 Thermostat install )

I agree with your plan, pick up another block, take your time and build it then do the swap.