big oops toyota.. [Archive] - Page 3 - NJFBOA - Home of New Jersey's Camaros and Firebirds

HeadlessNorseman

03-09-2010, 09:14 AM

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_runaway_prius

Is this article saying that the more or less 85hp prius has so much power that it cant slow from 94mph with the brakes fully depressed while going uphill? I find that really hard to believe. It sounds like this guy is just trying to get some money out of them.

"After the car decelerated to about 50 mph, Sikes turned off the engine and coasted to a halt."

not at 94 though? I just dont get it...

SteveR

03-09-2010, 09:25 AM

The CHP officer told him to push down on the brakes and the e-brake as hard as he could, and this was while they were going up hill. Once the car got down to 55mph, he turned the car off and the CHP officer moved his car in front of the Prius. And brakes aren't really designed to stop a rotating wheel at WOT.

BurninrubberGT

03-09-2010, 09:45 AM

now they are saying all the class action suits could cost toyota upwards of 3 billion

sweetbmxrider

03-09-2010, 09:47 AM

yeah brakes get hot and fade

BurninrubberGT

03-09-2010, 10:26 AM

the vibe brakes can stop the car at WOT, according to gm

LTb1ow

03-09-2010, 10:31 AM

Silly toyotas.

Tsar

03-09-2010, 11:45 AM

Oh the funny...

"How ABC News' Brian Ross Staged His Toyota Death Ride"
http://gawker.com/5486666/how-abc-news-brian-ross-staged-his-toyota-death-ride

LTb1ow

03-09-2010, 12:29 PM

"One of the things that makes it look scary is that when the acceleration occurs, Ross' piece cuts to a close-up shot of the Toyota's tachometer spiking up to 6,000 RPMs in the course of a second—the whole car is outfitted with cameras, and it looks like they planted one right on top of the dashboard to record the RPMs. Wow! That's fast."

LOL toyotas aren't fast... sillies...

Tsar

03-09-2010, 01:47 PM

WildBillyT

03-09-2010, 02:04 PM

When tach goes from 1k to 6k RPM in 1 SECOND, that's fast! :lol: Were they using one of those fancy 11ty billion horsepower supras?

Yup. And it also only runs 11's in the quarter.

qwikz28

03-09-2010, 03:02 PM

When tach goes from 1k to 6k RPM in 1 SECOND, that's fast! :lol: Were they using one of those fancy 11ty billion horsepower supras?

that doesn't really prove that the video was fake. But Toyota (and common sense) did prove that the guy's experiment was stupid. I am willing to bet any DBW car would have done the same thing.

I'm not sure if that Prius guy last night was faking it, but I'm sure much of it (if he wasn't faking) had to do with him not standing completely on the brakes and then they faded or pumping on them and losing vacuum.

Tsar

03-09-2010, 03:06 PM

that doesn't really prove that the video was fake. But Toyota (and common sense) did prove that the guy's experiment was stupid. I am willing to bet any DBW car would have done the same thing.

How about this?

ABC News spokesman Jeffrey Schneider confirmed to Gawker that the tachometer shot was indeed taken from the parked car and spliced into Ross' death ride

If they faked one thing, how many other things could they have possibly fake. The only reason someone admitted something is because they got caught manufacturing evidence.

WildBillyT

03-09-2010, 03:06 PM

that doesn't really prove that the video was fake. But Toyota (and common sense) did prove that the guy's experiment was stupid. I am willing to bet any DBW car would have done the same thing.

I'm not sure if that Prius guy last night was faking it, but I'm sure much of it (if he wasn't faking) had to do with him not standing completely on the brakes and then they faded or pumping on them and losing vacuum.

It certainly proves that the video was doctored heavily.

I'm a physicist, can I chime in? if he was going 20mph, he was certainly not in first gear- likely second (benefit of the doubt here for not being in third). Auto transmission=2.047 gear ratio, 3.815 final drive ratio (again, benefit of doubt), tire circumfrence 26.2in. 20mph in second=2130 rpm (vid showed 1000, but close 'nuff). Final RPM=6000 (went to 6500, but I'm REALLY taking it easy on him). MPH @ 6000=59.9. So..... this car can do 20MPH to 60MPH in 0.7 seconds in SECOND gear!!!!! I want one!!!! The RPM sweep would ACTUALLY take much longer (7-8+sec?). Anyone who owns an automatic one care to comment?

Seems to make sense to me. Selectively showing data and clips in a fashion that implies they point you are trying to prove is just as bad as making up evidence IMO.

qwikz28

03-09-2010, 03:08 PM

they conceded to the fact that the tach shot was done from a stop for safety, and filming reasons. Not saying it isn't fake, just that the tach shot doesn't prove the rest of it is.

As for the credibility, that I wouldn't be surprised with. Not much else is happening in the media these days :lol:

SteveR

03-09-2010, 03:18 PM

The physicist thing doesnt make all that much sense to me. He's forgetting about how the transmission works. If the transmission shifts off vacuum, and the car was moving up an incline, and you suddenly put your foot to the floor, you can definitely get the car to shift at or close to redline in whatever gear you're in before it up shifts. And where was he getting those numbers from for the transmission gear ratio and final drive ratio? Benefit of the doubt? That makes NO sense.

yea. That doesnt make sense to me. If that dudes a physicist, then me being able to push a slinky down stairs makes me Albert frikkin Einstein.

WildBillyT

03-09-2010, 03:20 PM

The physicist thing doesnt make all that much sense to me. He's forgetting about how the transmission works. If the transmission shifts off vacuum, and the car was moving up an incline, and you suddenly put your foot to the floor, you can definitely get the car to shift at or close to redline in whatever gear you're in before it up shifts. And where was he getting those numbers from for the transmission gear ratio and final drive ratio? Benefit of the doubt? That makes NO sense.

Numbers may not be on, but if you stomp on the gas in a Camry going 20mph in second gear it will not rev even close to that fast.

Here are the '09 Camry ratios:

http://www.vibratesoftware.com/html_help/html/Toyota/2009/2009_Toyota_Camry.htm

SteveR

03-09-2010, 03:26 PM

Here are the '09 Camry ratios:

http://www.vibratesoftware.com/html_help/html/Toyota/2009/2009_Toyota_Camry.htm

His "benefit of the doubt" comment on gear ratios is what really hurt my head. That's like saying the color yellow is mean, but not as mean as eggs, benefit of the doubt. WTF? :lol:

SteveR

03-09-2010, 03:31 PM

Numbers may not be on, but if you stomp on the gas in a Camry going 20mph in second gear it will not rev even close to that fast.

Here are the '09 Camry ratios:

http://www.vibratesoftware.com/html_help/html/Toyota/2009/2009_Toyota_Camry.htm

I think you could simulate it. Like when you keep the gas down juuuuust enough so that you can feel the trans right in the middle of whether it wants to shift down or remain in gear and you lightly feather the throttle to keep it there..... then right as it down shifts you floor it! 20mph in first going up hill I bet you could get it to rev high. I think if you summed the ratio of the quadratic angle of the relative flux capacitor to the negative terminal of the wabulator valve on Tuesdays after 5pm, you could make it work. But only with eggs.

WildBillyT

03-09-2010, 03:51 PM

I think you could simulate it. Like when you keep the gas down juuuuust enough so that you can feel the trans right in the middle of whether it wants to shift down or remain in gear and you lightly feather the throttle to keep it there..... then right as it down shifts you floor it! 20mph in first going up hill I bet you could get it to rev high. I think if you summed the ratio of the quadratic angle of the relative flux capacitor to the negative terminal of the wabulator valve on Tuesdays after 5pm, you could make it work. But only with eggs.

Rev high, sure. But not that fast. We are talking delta, not peak.

Bcozzi71

03-10-2010, 03:48 PM

I was just reading on another forum that its all a conspiracy by the US government to make people by American cars since they invested alot of money into them.

haha I chuckled

Mark B

03-10-2010, 05:54 PM

Yeah. I saw alot of that too.

SteveR

03-10-2010, 10:37 PM

This might hurt them juuuust a bit :lol:

http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/03/10/toyota.whistleblower/index.html?hpt=T2

LTb1ow

03-10-2010, 10:41 PM

yutt yoooo

Tru2Chevy

03-10-2010, 10:51 PM

This is gonna hurt.....

- Justin

BigAls87Z28

03-10-2010, 10:54 PM

Game, set, match.

Savage_Messiah

03-10-2010, 11:40 PM

I wish this had a facebook-style like button. One that I could click many many times.

BigAls87Z28

03-10-2010, 11:45 PM

You can give it 5 stars?

Savage_Messiah

03-10-2010, 11:48 PM

Totally forgot about that! Done!

LS1Hawk

03-11-2010, 04:59 AM

The pile keeps getting bigger and bigger.

T69SS

03-11-2010, 08:07 AM

Love it!

Anti_Rice_Guy

03-11-2010, 09:35 AM

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y218/nrfania/fania.jpg

Knipps

03-11-2010, 10:58 AM

Nick it looks like you could use some more practice in mspaint

Anti_Rice_Guy

03-11-2010, 12:35 PM

Nick it looks like you could use some more practice in mspaint

Wanna hook me up with a clearer one? :-P

NJ346

03-11-2010, 01:24 PM

right now if I owned anything toyota has made in the past decade I would be scared to drive. I wonder how insurance companies are going to evaluate quotes on toyotas from now on?

edpontiac91

03-11-2010, 06:07 PM

Unless I totally missed this in ANY thread, WHAT ever happened to putting the car in neutral and turning the KEY or BUTTON to OFF. I tried this with my wife's Grand Prix going about 40 mph and when I turned the key off, the entire car shut down. Even the cop had to shout out to the owner of the PREIUS to do this to his car and it did shut it down and the cop car was in front of it to make sure is came to a complete stop. :shock:

SteveR

03-12-2010, 12:14 AM

Investigate!

http://www.kansascity.com/2010/03/11/1805791/crash-closes-stretch-of-us-169.html

03-12-2010, 10:54 AM

Wanna hook me up with a clearer one? :-P

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d50/SmokingSS/nicklikes.png

SteveR

03-12-2010, 03:44 PM

Let the lawsuits begin

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20100312/us_nm/us_toyota

qwikz28

03-13-2010, 09:25 AM

Let the lawsuits begin

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20100312/us_nm/us_toyota

there are already multiple class action suits including California, NY, NJ, FL, and TX. I read some of the complaints for fun and it looks like they are pretty intense.

Also, the whistleblower lawyer has been around for a while now. He revealed alot of documents about other safety deficiencies like the 4Runner roof. Its gonna be interesting to see how this affects other automakers. Oh, and the lawyer is suiing Toyota himself.

BigAls87Z28

03-14-2010, 02:28 PM

SNL did a funny skit with Toyota....

SteveR

03-14-2010, 02:43 PM

SNL did a funny skit with Toyota....

Did the cast members run uncontrollably off the stage and into the audience?

BigAls87Z28

03-14-2010, 03:01 PM

Kiiiiiiinda...

http://jalopnik.com/5492832/the-anti+toyota-commercial-ford-wishes-it-had-the-balls-to-run?skyline=true&s=i

SteveR

03-14-2010, 10:49 PM

Kiiiiiiinda...

http://jalopnik.com/5492832/the-anti+toyota-commercial-ford-wishes-it-had-the-balls-to-run?skyline=true&s=i

LOL thats pretty funny

maroman88

03-16-2010, 12:45 AM

LOL!!!!!!!! awesome SNL commercial

Tsar

03-16-2010, 09:52 AM

Toyota sales are UP! GM should hire their guys :lol:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20100311/bs_nm/us_toyota_sales

BonzoHansen

03-16-2010, 10:27 AM

Toyota sales are UP! GM should hire their guys :lol:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20100311/bs_nm/us_toyota_sales

Congratulations Toyota, you just fell in to the discount abyss GM, Ford and others can't get out of.

"What they're doing right now is they are picking low-hanging fruit," said Chester Schriesheim, professor at the University of Miami School of Business Administration.

"These are the people who are undecided about the brand but given the lower price, now that provides incentives to go ahead and purchase," he said. "But they're going to exhaust that pool of individuals and then they'll find it harder in the longer term to raise the prices backward."

LS1Hawk

03-16-2010, 11:46 AM

I agree. In the long-run their sales will ultimately suffer.

Tsar

03-16-2010, 01:25 PM

I agree. In the long-run their sales will ultimately suffer.
You underestimate a good PR team...

BonzoHansen

03-16-2010, 04:41 PM

I agree. In the long-run their sales will ultimately suffer.

You underestimate a good PR team...

There is a long road to go down before either of these come true. But it may take the same multi generational time line it took to build them up to where they are now. It certainly took audi a long time to regroup form their throttle issues. and their issues were nothing like this.

Featherburner

03-16-2010, 05:19 PM

Interesting...
http://www.nydailynews.com/money/2010/03/16/2010-03-16_group_of_toyota_owners_sues_japanese_automaker_ demanding_full_refund_for_recalle.html

Tsar

03-16-2010, 07:00 PM

There is a long road to go down before either of these come true. But it may take the same multi generational time line it took to build them up to where they are now. It certainly took audi a long time to regroup form their throttle issues. and their issues were nothing like this.Indeed, it will be awhile. Can you refresh me on an Audi thing. Wasn't it largely a user error, and just like in this case there was some manufactured evidence, this time it was on 60 minutes though. Or am I mistaken them with someone else?

Interesting...
http://www.nydailynews.com/money/2010/03/16/2010-03-16_group_of_toyota_owners_sues_japanese_automaker_ demanding_full_refund_for_recalle.html
Meh, last I heard no one has been able to recreate the problem. And I doubt that court will issue a judgment for a person(s) not "liking" their car... Clever spread of hysteria though. If they do it will certainly open up pandoras box.

BonzoHansen

03-16-2010, 08:02 PM

Indeed, it will be awhile. Can you refresh me on an Audi thing. Wasn't it largely a user error, and just like in this case there was some manufactured evidence, this time it was on 60 minutes though. Or am I mistaken them with someone else?

Matters not. In the end it was determined to be user error. In fact I just learned that case changed pedal placement design across the industry, and why many cars have a brake pedal higher than the gas pedal (my #1 driving peeve of my Olds).

But Audi got dragged in the mud for years. Truth is not truth, perception is truth. Fact is Audi's sales got hurt and it took years to rebound. And what we are watching here is probably 10x worse because 1) Toyota admits there are issues and 2) a lot more people are impacted just based on sales/# of owners. However they have more goodwill in the bank than Audi did to offset that some. If this were Kia you'd say bye bye Kia.

Tsar

03-16-2010, 08:08 PM

I don't need a lecture about truth and perception. I was asking for the facts of the case because I did not remember them. I only remember general stuff. Toyota will spin this in a positive way, just like they are doing with rebates, they are marketing them as a reward for sticking with them/and as a one time event vs when GM does it - it's "hey buy our ****** car because we can't sell them otherwise, and if you don't buy them today, there will be a sale tomorrow".

It's all about PR, always has been, truth does not matter.

BonzoHansen

03-16-2010, 08:19 PM

Oh, I misread your comment. Here. (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=audi+gas+pedal+problem). I wouldn't really call 1 sentence a lecture.

Tsar

03-16-2010, 08:21 PM

Oh, I misread your comment. Here. (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=audi+gas+pedal+problem). I wouldn't really call 1 sentence a lecture.
First link in your search says Toyota accelerator fix :lol:

Audi thing has never happened. Truth has been changed.

Edit* actually most links on the first page have to do with Toyota. :lol:

Savage_Messiah

03-17-2010, 02:28 AM

Toyota sales are UP! GM should hire their guys :lol:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20100311/bs_nm/us_toyota_sales

You underestimate a good PR team...

Indeed, it will be awhile. Can you refresh me on an Audi thing. Wasn't it largely a user error, and just like in this case there was some manufactured evidence, this time it was on 60 minutes though. Or am I mistaken them with someone else?

Meh, last I heard no one has been able to recreate the problem. And I doubt that court will issue a judgment for a person(s) not "liking" their car... Clever spread of hysteria though. If they do it will certainly open up pandoras box.

I don't need a lecture about truth and perception. I was asking for the facts of the case because I did not remember them. I only remember general stuff. Toyota will spin this in a positive way, just like they are doing with rebates, they are marketing them as a reward for sticking with them/and as a one time event vs when GM does it - it's "hey buy our ****** car because we can't sell them otherwise, and if you don't buy them today, there will be a sale tomorrow".

It's all about PR, always has been, truth does not matter.

Holy ****, you are a worse nutswinger than Al is

Tsar

03-17-2010, 10:09 AM

Holy ****, you are a worse nutswinger than Al is
I already said I don't like Toyota cars. I think not liking a product of a certain company kind of excludes me from being a nutswinger. Their PR team is way above GM's though. You should have stayed in college and sharped up those reading comprehension skills.

Grow up a little, oh wait...

BigAls87Z28

03-17-2010, 09:10 PM

Tsar

03-17-2010, 10:11 PM

Having a better PR team then GM is probably the easiest thing in the world.
Toyota's mega PR team is not working as well as it did. It keeps having problems. The issued another big recall for the Tundras, and now Honda is getting caught up on "lack of breaking" for CRV and Element models if I heard right today.
Well PR can only do so much, if Toyota's keep braking/being recalled than PR won't help much. They gotta stop the bleeding so PR can do their job.

SteveR

03-17-2010, 10:51 PM

Well PR can only do so much, if Toyota's keep braking/being recalled than PR won't help much. They gotta stop the bleeding so PR can do their job.

I dunno, people aren't always that smart. All the talk of Toyotas crashing and killing people and their sales went UP :lol:

BigAls87Z28

03-17-2010, 11:19 PM

Yep....crazy. That happens.

Savage_Messiah

03-18-2010, 02:58 AM

Well PR can only do so much, if Toyota's keep braking/being recalled than PR won't help much. They gotta stop the bleeding so PR can do their job.

Not possessive, so you meant Toyatas. You also meant breaking. All that money for college has done you well.

Tsar

03-18-2010, 07:11 AM

Not possessive, so you meant Toyatas. You also meant breaking. All that money for college has done you well.
Awwe, is someone a little bitter? It's ok little one. :lol:

Anti_Rice_Guy

03-18-2010, 07:52 AM

The issued another big recall for the Tundras,

This one? :lol:

http://jalopnik.com/5495410/toyota-announces-huge-2010-tundra-recall

Tsar

03-18-2010, 08:25 AM

This one? :lol:

http://jalopnik.com/5495410/toyota-announces-huge-2010-tundra-recall
Two? :lol: WTF, how does that happen?

qwikz28

03-18-2010, 01:45 PM

Not possessive, so you meant Toyatas. You also meant breaking. All that money for college has done you well.

Or has it made him a genius? I thought it was a play on words when I read it!

Featherburner

03-18-2010, 03:57 PM

Or has it made him a genius? I thought it was a play on words when I read it!You're giving him way too much credit.

SteveR

03-21-2010, 08:00 PM

This should be interesting

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_toyota_investor_ire

Tsar

03-21-2010, 09:47 PM

This should be interesting

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_toyota_investor_ire
Waait, This is over 10.66 cents in stock prices? Am I reading this right?

qwikz28

03-21-2010, 09:53 PM

Waait, This is over 10.66 cents in stock prices? Am I reading this right?

$10.66. For someone with thousands of shares, that is a decent chunk of money.

Tsar

03-21-2010, 09:57 PM

$10.66. For someone with thousands of shares, that is a decent chunk of money.
I'm well aware of that. But they are UP from the time the recall started. Plus if this lawsuit was to succeed, where would we stop? What if stock dips by 5 dollars? Do I sue? 4 bucks? 2.50? Any dip in stock is a loss to someone. How do we determine that the loss has been sufficient enough that one can sue a company?

And as I already said their stock is UP by $1.34 overall since the recalls began, so are we suiting for what "could have been?".

With that said, anyone can file a lawsuit so any reason. My guess this will be tossed out.. But only time will tell.

FlyingDutchman

03-21-2010, 10:00 PM

Not so much they lost money...

Toyota spread misleading information through press releases, conference calls with stock analysts and TV interviews to assure stockholders and the public that the accelerator problem was easily fixed or might be the driver's fault.

Tsar

03-21-2010, 10:08 PM

Not so much they lost money...
The part that worries me is:

"This drop removed the inflation from Toyota's securities prices, causing real economic loss to investors who had purchased securities," said Stackhouse, who said he bought 40 shares in late 2009 just as the accelerator problems became more widely known.

Stackhouse and the others filing suit — shareholders from Ohio and Tennessee_ did not return several telephone calls seeking comment. All three investors filed sworn statements that they did not buy the shares as an excuse to sue the company.

"Dude" bought 40 shares, and he is complaining about "real economic hard". Smells funky.

FlyingDutchman

03-21-2010, 10:19 PM

The part that worries me is:

"Dude" bought 40 shares, and he is complaining about "real economic hard". Smells funky.

You make a valid point there ... all I can say is what a mess! Where would you draw the line?

BigAls87Z28

03-21-2010, 11:49 PM

Be it 1 share, or 4000 shares, they mislead shareholders, which is agaisnt FTC's laws.

Tsar

03-22-2010, 07:57 AM

Be it 1 share, or 4000 shares, they mislead shareholders, which is agaisnt FTC's laws.
And people already tried to sue ford, and failed. And why aren't you suing GM?

BigAls87Z28

03-22-2010, 09:46 AM

You can't sue the messiah, its blasphemy.

You are and idiot.

Can't sue GM for going into Chap 11. I sold it before it went to crap. Can't say the same for my brother. Bondholders put together a law suit but they had to get in line.

Tsar

03-22-2010, 11:10 AM

You are and idiot.

Can't sue GM for going into Chap 11. I sold it before it went to crap. Can't say the same for my brother. Bondholders put together a law suit but they had to get in line.

But you still took a loss, if I remember correctly. Did you intend on taking a loss when you were buying stock? Or were you hoping, based on some info, that GM stock would go up in price and you would be able to sell somewhere down the road for more? Was the info you were basing your information on misleading? Of course it was, the stock tanked. So I think you should file a suit too... and claim economic harm.

BigAls87Z28

03-22-2010, 11:57 AM

Ahh...no, going to the government, and asking for money to help them survive was not a "HEY, WE ARE DOING OK!! DONT WORRY ABOUT THIS!" move.
Toyota, on the other hand, downplayed and just shrugged it off as it was just a simple little mistake like a stupid floor mat.
Stocks go up and down. But if you manipulate the news to stimulate stock pricing, then thats illegal.
Anyone that was still hoping for GM to pull it out was crazy. But people expected Ford to take a crap as well. Some people held on, like my brother did, and now he has easily covered his loss at GM.
Yet...some how you drag GM into this.
Toyota lied and cheated the American people, but I guess its ok since its just a few bucks for a few people.

BonzoHansen

03-22-2010, 12:29 PM

I think the legal question is did Toyota withhold material information and thus mislead shareholders. This is hard to prove. That is what NY’s Cuomo and company are trying to pin on BoA related to the Merrill purchase. They argue the bank failed to tell investors about Merrill bonuses and much higher then expected losses just prior to the shareholder vote to approve the buyout. BoA is arguing that is was not material (and they were pushed by the government). I think an agreement to some of the suits was recently reached. Here the argument will be Toyota hid the fact they knew they had billions in potential liabilities and reputational damage and said nothing. I’m not sure how that will go, probably a settlement of some sort. Which is why they file.

I do not think old GM did that. The numbers in their annual reports are what they are, with never ending negative cash flows. Anyone who looked at the numbers knew that. Every analyst report I looked at talked about it. There was no underlying issue that was never publically documented. They outlined their turnaround plan and an investor could choose to believe it or not. But that plan did not forecast a historic drop in auto sales, the proverbial last nail in the coffin. But the info is there, I know of no intention misleading of investors. Poor management itself is not a crime, nor is a drop in share value. Shareholders do elect BOD members who pick management. So they can sue themselves.

Now stop picking on Al.

SteveR

03-22-2010, 02:35 PM

I saw on the news this morning that the shareholders are suing because they do have proof. They claim Toyota provided them with false information and claimed that all of the acceleration problems were due solely to user error and it was because people were jamming the floor mat against the gas pedal. They told the shareholders that all of this would go away and to keep buying stocks and the stock prices were going to go up. They also said on the news that Toyota provided them with doctored reports and false information.

Tsar

03-22-2010, 05:01 PM

Toyota, on the other hand, downplayed and just shrugged it off as it was just a simple little mistake like a stupid floor mat. Show me proof where it says they maliciously did what they did, and it was not a simple mistake? You can't. End of story. To this day no one has been able to re create what this fuss is all about.

Stocks go up and down. But if you manipulate the news to stimulate stock pricing, then thats illegal.Sure, if one can prove that there was some sort of manipulation.

Yet...some how you drag GM into this. It was an example, you can replace GM with any company if you like. Now dig out your panties out of your vag.

I think the legal question is did Toyota withhold material information and thus mislead shareholders. This is hard to prove. Ford was sued for a similar thing, whoever was suing failed. Company is not obligated to release any kind of info unless they are absolutely sure of it, so this gives no reason to Toyota to murder their own stock prices as they figure out what's going on.

I do not think old GM did that. The numbers in their annual reports are what they are, with never ending negative cash flows. Anyone who looked at the numbers knew that. GM has mislead plenty of people, from re-badging Chevy's as a Caddy, to side saddle gas tanks. I don't want to give Al a heart attack though.

Now stop picking on Al.It's fun to do :lol:

I saw on the news this morning that the shareholders are suing because they do have proof. They claim Toyota provided them with false information and claimed that all of the acceleration problems were due solely to user error and it was because people were jamming the floor mat against the gas pedal.If they have proof, great!

Just now I saw some commissioner dude on TV who was talking about the latest prius crash where the woman claimed that her car got away from her because the gas pedal got jammed and she was not able to stop; even though she was mashing the brake as hard as she could. It was said that she's a big liar and never stepped on the brakes, the accident was determined to be a user error.

I'm still waiting for someone to re create this Toyota run away problem without crafty video editing.

Ok I'm spent.. :mrgreen:

BigAls87Z28

03-22-2010, 05:55 PM

You are such a ****, really.

Why recreate it when more people can die? Or more documents can come out showing that Toyota have, and for some time, tried to cover up thier problems.

SteveR

03-22-2010, 06:00 PM

Or more documents can come out showing that Toyota have, and for some time, tried to cover up thier problems.

That's what that lawyer claims to have. Documents showing that Toyota covered up the problems, as well as withheld information in the lawsuits, and doctored the crash tests.

Tsar

03-22-2010, 06:39 PM

That's what that lawyer claims to have. Documents showing that Toyota covered up the problems, as well as withheld information in the lawsuits, and doctored the crash tests.
If that was the case they would probably get "leaked" by now.

P.S. Al needs a hug.

SteveR

03-22-2010, 07:08 PM

If that was the case they would probably get "leaked" by now.

P.S. Al needs a hug.

There was something about how he isn't allowed to release them.

Tsar

03-22-2010, 07:44 PM

There was something about how he isn't allowed to release them.
Top secret info gets "leaked" somehow. :lol:

Mark B

03-23-2010, 05:38 AM

Top secret info gets "leaked" somehow. :lol:

Not if the lawyer is holding on to it hoping for a big payoff to keep it secret.

WildBillyT

03-23-2010, 08:36 AM

Not if the lawyer is holding on to it hoping for a big payoff to keep it secret.

Or if he's the only one who has it. If it "leaks" they know who did it.

Tsar

03-23-2010, 09:38 AM

Or if he's the only one who has it. If it "leaks" they know who did it.
Come on, there are so many ways around that...

Edit* plus what are the odds that he is the ONLY person that has documents that can "put the final nail in a Toyota coffin"? I'm gonna go with slim.

WildBillyT

03-23-2010, 10:25 AM

Come on, there are so many ways around that...

Edit* plus what are the odds that he is the ONLY person that has documents that can "put the final nail in a Toyota coffin"? I'm gonna go with slim.

If they are internal documents with only a few names on them other than his, then the only thing that's slim is the size of the universe of people that can prove they exist. What would he claim if they got "leaked"? That it wasn't him, somebody hacked Toyota's servers and specifically grabbed those documents? :rofl:

Tsar

03-23-2010, 10:44 AM

If they are internal documents with only a few names on them other than his, then the only thing that's slim is the size of the universe of people that can prove they exist. What would he claim if they got "leaked"? That it wasn't him, somebody hacked Toyota's servers and specifically grabbed those documents? :rofl:
Hacked, stolen, left his computer open and someone got in. Everyone makes "mistakes".

Recently I got a piece of mail from one of the top US intel agencies, it went something like this;

"Because you have traveled on our behalf during the period of XXX we have all of your information on file. Unfortunately, the information was not protected and anyone with access to our computers could have access to it. Every person in the compound is required to have a top secret clearance so the chance of identity theft is minimal, although possible. If you suspect that you have been a victim of identity theft please contact us as soon as possible".

This was a letter from an agency that has WAY more money and way more security that Toyota can dream of, despite that they exposed MY information, and information of other people who were tagged with me on those documents... Do you know what Toyota security procedures are? I doubt it. Does Toyota require their employees to have a top secret clearance, I doubt it. Is it possible to steal info from Toyota? It's possible to steal anything from anyone.

More serious stuff has "leaked" in the past.

WildBillyT

03-23-2010, 11:08 AM

Hacked, stolen, left his computer open and someone got in. Everyone makes "mistakes".

Recently I got a piece of mail from one of the top US intel agencies, it went something like this;

"Because you have traveled on our behalf during the period of XXX we have all of your information on file. Unfortunately, the information was not protected and anyone with access to our computers could have access to it. Every person in the compound is required to have a top secret clearance so the chance of identity theft is minimal, although possible. If you suspect that you have been a victim of identity theft please contact us as soon as possible".

This was a letter from an agency that has WAY more money and way more security that Toyota can dream of, despite that they exposed MY information, and information of other people who were tagged with me on those documents... Do you know what Toyota security procedures are? I doubt it. Does Toyota require their employees to have a top secret clearance, I doubt it. Is it possible to steal info from Toyota? It's possible to steal anything from anyone.

More serious stuff has "leaked" in the past.

The government is a bad example, but I get it. The thing is that the documents in question were probably only seen by a select few (a guess based on how nobody else mentioned they have them) so hackers or ID thieves would probably have no idea what they were, or what they look like. Unless he's dumb enough to have a folder marked "SECRET TOYOTA DOCS" on his machine. If 10 people know they exist and who might have them then only 10 people are "in charge of their security".

Tsar

03-23-2010, 11:45 AM

The government is a bad example, but I get it. The thing is that the documents in question were probably only seen by a select few (a guess based on how nobody else mentioned they have them) so hackers or ID thieves would probably have no idea what they were, or what they look like. Unless he's dumb enough to have a folder marked "SECRET TOYOTA DOCS" on his machine. If 10 people know they exist and who might have them then only 10 people are "in charge of their security".

Well if he is leaking them on purpose then he would have no problem saying that he had a folder named "secret toyota docs" and it was hacked. Of course, if he wanted to keep them private than it would be a pretty dumb move to have them marked as such, but that's not what we are talking about here :lol:

Is there a statue that says that one must go above and beyond to safeguard documents that are not classified? <- real question.

Featherburner

03-23-2010, 08:15 PM

They know he has the documents.
http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/03/10/toyota.whistleblower/index.html

SteveR

04-05-2010, 05:02 PM

The Government decided today to hit Toyota with the largest automaker fine in history.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100405/ap_on_bi_ge/us_toyota_recall

Anti_Rice_Guy

04-07-2010, 07:27 AM

http://www.fquick.com/blog/GM_To_Install_Brake_Override_Software_in_Cars/3782 Hyundai does this now too I know

SteveR

04-07-2010, 12:52 PM

more oops

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100407/ap_on_bi_ge/us_toyota_recall

SteveR

04-13-2010, 09:30 AM

latest oops :lol:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Consumer-Reports-calls-Lexus-apf-2415389625.html?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=main&asset=&ccode=

Tsar

04-13-2010, 10:11 AM

latest oops :lol:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Consumer-Reports-calls-Lexus-apf-2415389625.html?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=main&asset=&ccode=
Saw that on tv. I also found humorous the "could cause a roll over" line. I "can" cause a rollover in any SUV :lol:

Also "In a real world situation, by that time, the car can hit the curb or the side of the road and that's the situation where, in a vehicle like that, it could cause it to roll over,"Pretty sure if the curb is high enough pretty much any SUV will roll over given enough speed :lol:

LS1Hawk

04-13-2010, 10:33 AM

It is amazing that CR is actually calling a Toyota product unsafe.

FlyingDutchman

04-13-2010, 11:56 AM

Saw that on tv. I also found humorous the "could cause a roll over" line. I "can" cause a rollover in any SUV :lol:

Also Pretty sure if the curb is high enough pretty much any SUV will roll over given enough speed :lol:

I think the point was that the electronic stability control kicked in way to late to do anything. Anyone can flip an SUV lol

Frosty

04-13-2010, 01:54 PM

Toyota deserves to be run through the mud but it seems like everyone is trying to take a shot at them, it's going overboard IMO.

Tru2Chevy

04-13-2010, 05:01 PM

Toyota deserves to be run through the mud but it seems like everyone is trying to take a shot at them, it's going overboard IMO.

I agree to a point, but when Consumer Reports does it, you know it's bad. They are the biggest Toyota nuthuggers alive.

- Justin

Tsar

04-13-2010, 07:48 PM

Lexus Stops Selling S.U.V. That Was Called Unsafe (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/14/business/14auto.html?src=busln) :lol:

SteveR

04-13-2010, 09:25 PM

I just saw the test video on tv. Wow, that Lexus looks like a drift car :lol:

Tsar

04-13-2010, 09:28 PM

I just saw the test video on tv. Wow, that Lexus looks like a drift car :lol:
yea I saw that on tv, but how many people will actually push their car?For example, my mom doesn't go fast enough around a turn for her Caddy to lean on one side or another - she says, if it leans it's going too fast............ She probably doesn't even know that her car has stability control :lol:

Tru2Chevy

04-13-2010, 09:40 PM

That's very true. Anyone driving one of those that "accidentally" gets into a lift throttle oversteer situation is a whackjob anyway.

- Justin

BonzoHansen

04-13-2010, 09:50 PM

Saw that on tv. I also found humorous the "could cause a roll over" line. I "can" cause a rollover in any SUV :lol:

Also Pretty sure if the curb is high enough pretty much any SUV will roll over given enough speed :lol:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uxUS5DByrgo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=possmqmq2rw

Tru2Chevy

04-13-2010, 09:57 PM

Watch it slide here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMOgLushL40

Jump ahead to the :40 second mark.

- Justin

BonzoHansen

04-13-2010, 10:03 PM

it didn't roll.

Tsar

04-13-2010, 10:29 PM

it didn't roll.
:werd:

To be fair they did say it "COULD ROLL" not that it did roll. :lol:

Seems like someone was a little overzealous.

BonzoHansen

04-13-2010, 10:34 PM

w/o cool electronics that bitch rolls like a bowling ball.

SteveR

04-16-2010, 08:36 PM

Here's some more :lol:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100416/ap_on_bi_ge/us_toyota_recall

BigAls87Z28

04-16-2010, 09:52 PM

Vitals is still supporting Toyota, yet thrashes GM at the drop of a hat.
He drags out a 35 year old recall, but pretends that all of what is going on is not a big deal.
Love it. And Im the nut-hugger.

Tsar

04-16-2010, 09:52 PM

Rusting spare tire cable? give me a break...........

Tsar

04-16-2010, 09:53 PM

BigAls87Z28

04-16-2010, 10:02 PM

Where did I "support" Toyota?

Its how you just kind of throw this whole thing up in the air as circumstantial and just people with wild imaginations. Its all just coincidence that all this is happening. Just look at your last few responses

Saw that on tv. I also found humorous the "could cause a roll over" line. I "can" cause a rollover in any SUV :lol:

Also Pretty sure if the curb is high enough pretty much any SUV will roll over given enough speed :lol:

Yeah, any SUV could roll over. CR just tested THIS SUV only inthis manner, and not the others.

yea I saw that on tv, but how many people will actually push their car?For example, my mom doesn't go fast enough around a turn for her Caddy to lean on one side or another - she says, if it leans it's going too fast............ She probably doesn't even know that her car has stability control :lol:

How many companies hault the production of thier car for just no reason?

:werd:

To be fair they did say it "COULD ROLL" not that it did roll. :lol:

Seems like someone was a little overzealous.

Yeah, thats it....

Featherburner

04-16-2010, 10:35 PM

Rusting spare tire cable? give me a break...........Why?

WildBillyT

04-16-2010, 10:39 PM

Why?

Agreed. There was a pickup recall done for a similar type of thing- happening to bed cables.

BonzoHansen

04-16-2010, 10:40 PM

Rusting spare tire cable? give me a break...........

until that tire falls off the vehicle in front of you and bashes into your car. With any luck it doesn't come through your windshield.

BigAls87Z28

04-16-2010, 10:54 PM

Big truck tire...figure spare is at least a 17 inch steel wheel with a large 265/70-17 on it.
Just drops from under a truck at 70mph. Shesh, give Vitals a break.

SteveR

04-16-2010, 11:26 PM

until that tire falls off the vehicle in front of you and bashes into your car. With any luck it doesn't come through your windshield.

Happened to a friend of mine once and I was in the passenger seat. Truck in front of us on the Parkway lost his spare tire @70mph. No way to avoid it and went right over it. Tore the oil pan apart, the trans tailshaft, broke the driveshaft, and destroyed the exhaust and rear suspension. It's a miracle we weren't killed.

Tsar

04-17-2010, 02:31 PM

Its how you just kind of throw this whole thing up in the air as circumstantial and just people with wild imaginations. Its all just coincidence that all this is happening. Just look at your last few responses
I love how the fact that I do not bash toyota on this board equates to me being their fan. :lol:

I'm sorry if I don't take a magazine article and religiously follow it like it was written by some god. There have been dozens of articles posted here against GM and you run to defend them 9 out of 10 times. Yet, me not believing an article is somehow "bad". Funny how that works out.

For future references, just because I do not bash a product does not mean I like it; as already stated I do not like Toyota, and I would NOT buy any of their cars. It doesn't get much more clear cut than that. I can even go as far as to say that I would buy one GM car before I bought a Toyota/Lexus.

Yeah, any SUV could roll over. CR just tested THIS SUV only inthis manner, and not the others. You know, if they tested only THIS SUV than it just becomes much more irrelevant. But thanks for trying.

Plus, their test did NOT show that the car even tips over, they simply said "COULD ROLL OVER". You know what? Mini Cooper "COULD ROLL OVER", and I have seen one on it's roof. Does that mean that every car is unsafe now? After all if you could roll a cooper you could pretty much roll any car......

How many companies hault the production of thier car for just no reason? What would be a better move, of you great PR person? Since we are on a subject of roll overs, can you name me a car that received WORSE roll over rating than a Ford Explorer, in early 2000's? I'll give you a hint, Ford got 2 starts and was sued for millions, this awesome product was ONE, ONE!!!, star and nothing was done about it, if I remember correctly. Is that the right move? Just continue producing junk?

Why?It's a car, it will rust. I used to have a roommate who drove a SAAB; every time he would start that beast, or move from a stand still, he would leave a chunk of it behind. Where was the recall?

7998

04-17-2010, 07:38 PM

Not to disrupt a good pissin' match. But the fact that toyota is imploding makes me happy. For years I tried explaining to the un-informed that toyotas aren't made any better or more reliable nor do magic fairys sprinkle dust on each one.
Typical Japenese business philosophy, build it to only hold up to the average person under average conditions and nothing more.
When I worked for honda they were the same way. It was always the customers fault if there was a problem, never their over-rated product.

WildBillyT

04-17-2010, 08:17 PM

]It's a car, it will rust. I used to have a roommate who drove a SAAB; every time he would start that beast, or move from a stand still, he would leave a chunk of it behind. Where was the recall?

I don't think there's any reason for anything less than 10 years old to have an issue with rust. Import, domestic, or whatever. Even in the rust belt states. It's not like the 60's and 70's where galvanizing and rust proofing wasn't really done, and stainless steel wasn't used at all.

And FWIW, I said the same thing when GM recalled their trucks for frame rust issues. And when Toyota did the same.

BigAls87Z28

04-18-2010, 12:57 AM

I love how the fact that I do not bash toyota on this board equates to me being their fan. :lol:

I'm sorry if I don't take a magazine article and religiously follow it like it was written by some god. There have been dozens of articles posted here against GM and you run to defend them 9 out of 10 times. Yet, me not believing an article is somehow "bad". Funny how that works out.

I didnt say anything about following any article in a religious nature.
It has nothing to do with this specific article, but your general outlook on this whole situation.
Dozens of articles against GM? Show me them, and show me my defense of GM whole heartedly and as blind as you. Do I try to correct some misnomers in some articles, or come out against op-eds, then yes.
Your reaction to any of the articles posted ranged from laughing at the thought, to total dismissal?
I dont expect you to follow any brand, but your blindeness on this whole issue of Toyota making faulity product is hilarious. You shrug it off, but then pull out issues some 30+ years ago from GM, to say that they also made bad products. You dont have to bash it, but you dismissal of all the articles sure comes off as you defending them to boarderline apologetic for them.

What would be a better move, of you great PR person? Since we are on a subject of roll overs, can you name me a car that received WORSE roll over rating than a Ford Explorer, in early 2000's? I'll give you a hint, Ford got 2 starts and was sued for millions, this awesome product was ONE, ONE!!!, star and nothing was done about it, if I remember correctly. Is that the right move? Just continue producing junk?

First off, the line was a mention that the GX is an unsafe vehicle, and that it should be haulted. Im not saying it SHOULDNT have been, it was more sarcasim in your general attitude that this is just really a big joke.

A Ford Explorer was not from the 00's, but late 90's, over a decade ago, that had more to do with stupid drivers not checking tire pressures for low grade tires. The problem is that the Explorers were top heavy, and the A/B/C/D pillars were not strong enough to hold the car up.
But Ford fixed it, lowerd its center of gravity, and they dont flip over anymore. They also replaced millions of Firestone tires for free.

maroman88

04-19-2010, 10:54 PM

ohh look they're blaming it on the software!

Associated Press

WASHINGTON — Toyota says it will recall its 2010 Lexus GX 460 to address a potential problem with the SUV’s stability control system that targets possible rollovers.

The recall affects about 9,400 vehicles that have been sold since the SUV went on sale in late December. Consumer Reports issued a “Don’t Buy” warning last week on the 2010 GX 460, saying it was susceptible to rolling over.

Toyota says dealers will update software in the vehicle stability control system. Toyota already had halted sales of new GX 460s and begun tests on all of its SUVs.

The automaker also agreed to pay a record $16.4 million fine on Monday for failing to properly report a safety problem with defective gas pedals.

Tsar

04-22-2010, 03:16 PM

I didnt say anything about following any article in a religious nature.
It has nothing to do with this specific article, but your general outlook on this whole situation.
Dozens of articles against GM? Show me them, and show me my defense of GM whole heartedly and as blind as you. Do I try to correct some misnomers in some articles, or come out against op-eds, then yes.
Your reaction to any of the articles posted ranged from laughing at the thought, to total dismissal?
I dont expect you to follow any brand, but your blindeness on this whole issue of Toyota making faulity product is hilarious. You shrug it off, but then pull out issues some 30+ years ago from GM, to say that they also made bad products. You dont have to bash it, but you dismissal of all the articles sure comes off as you defending them to boarderline apologetic for them.

First off, the line was a mention that the GX is an unsafe vehicle, and that it should be haulted. Im not saying it SHOULDNT have been, it was more sarcasim in your general attitude that this is just really a big joke.

A Ford Explorer was not from the 00's, but late 90's, over a decade ago, that had more to do with stupid drivers not checking tire pressures for low grade tires. The problem is that the Explorers were top heavy, and the A/B/C/D pillars were not strong enough to hold the car up.
But Ford fixed it, lowerd its center of gravity, and they dont flip over anymore. They also replaced millions of Firestone tires for free.
I really don't have the time to find your post nutswinging for GM, if you're in denial then so be it. I'd rather study for LSAT, at least I know that it will pay off in june.

By the way, I was talking about Blazer/Jimmy not the exploder, why don't you re-read my post, it received 1 star rollover rating in 2001. Did anyone stop production, nah, just continued to sell them and make money. I had a handy dandy link somewhere about how many people died as a result of a roll over in those cars, but I can't find it right now. But of course it won't be GMs fault anyway, so why bother.

Anyways, Toyota sucks, GM is great. Back to LSAT.

Anti_Rice_Guy

04-28-2010, 10:42 AM

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704423504575212071171869104.html?m od=WSJ_auto_IndustryCollection

Recalls 03 Sequoias

Frosty

04-28-2010, 10:44 AM

Do you think Toyota is going overboard to save face now with all of these "other" recalls or is the situation truly that bad?

WildBillyT

04-28-2010, 11:02 AM

Do you think Toyota is going overboard to save face now with all of these "other" recalls or is the situation truly that bad?

IMO:

The cat is out of the bag with its tail on fire.

T69SS

04-28-2010, 11:04 AM

Do you think Toyota is going overboard to save face now with all of these "other" recalls or is the situation truly that bad?

It almost seems that way

BigAls87Z28

04-28-2010, 11:30 AM

Eh, had there not been the big 8 million car, no-stopping deal..some of this stuff would have been like other Yoda recalls.

FlyingDutchman

04-28-2010, 03:16 PM

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704423504575212071171869104.html?m od=WSJ_auto_IndustryCollection

Recalls 03 Sequoias

No need to subscribe :mrgreen: (http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Toyota-to-recall-about-50000-apf-897178558.html?x=0)

Anti_Rice_Guy

05-04-2010, 05:39 PM

http://www.fquick.com/blog/Toyota_faces_327_state__federal_lawsuits/3826

Tsar

05-04-2010, 05:44 PM

http://www.fquick.com/blog/Toyota_faces_327_state__federal_lawsuits/3826
Finally, something that Al can prance around about! :lol:

FlyingDutchman

05-04-2010, 07:53 PM

wow possibility of paying $3,000,000,000 for 327 lawsuits...

Tsar

05-04-2010, 08:01 PM

wow possibility of paying $3,000,000,000 for 327 lawsuits...
that was a conservative estimate.

BigAls87Z28

05-04-2010, 09:46 PM

Maybe it will make thier "value" go down.

SteveR

05-21-2010, 02:26 PM

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100521/ap_on_bi_ge/us_toyota_recall

91chevywt

06-09-2010, 07:19 PM

Anyone know what happened with this? Seems like everything with toyota has been pushed aside with the oil spill

LTb1ow

06-09-2010, 07:23 PM

Anyone know what happened with this? Seems like everything with toyota has been pushed aside with the oil spill

Yes, you solved the conspiracy. :rofl:

In other news, GM cars are bursting into flames again! w00tz!

91chevywt

06-09-2010, 07:30 PM

Didn't mean it like it was a conspiracy, I just mean that it seems like there is more important stuff in the news so it got pushed aside and was out of everyone's mind overnight without being properly resolved

Knipps

06-09-2010, 09:53 PM

welcome to politics and the american media.

FlyingDutchman

07-01-2010, 07:23 AM

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Toyota-says-270000-vehicles-apf-3053500009.html?x=0

defective engines lol

07-01-2010, 08:56 AM

*like*

iroc86NJ

07-01-2010, 09:04 AM

Valve spring issues is what I've heard. Toyota say that certain Lexus engines may stall as a result.....

I pity the mechanics that have to correct this issue. What.... no.... on second thought these mechanics have excellent job security. In other new, I think i'm gonna get certified to work on Toyotas. :nod:

Anti_Rice_Guy

07-01-2010, 10:06 AM

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Toyota-says-270000-vehicles-apf-3053500009.html?x=0

defective engines lol

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y218/nrfania/fania.jpg

NastyEllEssWon

07-01-2010, 10:30 AM

well thats one way to get em to stop :lol:

FlyingDutchman

07-06-2010, 05:09 PM

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/toyota-shares-fall-after-news-of-lexus-recall-2010-06-27

This was a 17000 car recall last week

Also, Canadian sales for toyota fall 14% while GM sales are up 54% with GM outselling toyota!

http://www.cbc.ca/money/story/2010/07/05/toyota-canada-june-sales.html

Anti_Rice_Guy

07-06-2010, 07:13 PM

FlyingDutchman

07-06-2010, 07:42 PM

TBH I'm more surprised by the fact that you didn't post a yahoo link for once :lol:

Oh sorry I got one here for you! :mrgreen:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Toyota-knew-about-Lexus-apf-601465795.html?x=0

Apparently they knew about this problem 2 years ago and thought it was some microscopic particle, when really the problem was a design flaw haha fail.

jims69camaro

07-12-2010, 02:42 PM

Oh sorry I got one here for you! :mrgreen:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Toyota-knew-about-Lexus-apf-601465795.html?x=0

Apparently they knew about this problem 2 years ago and thought it was some microscopic particle, when really the problem was a design flaw haha fail.

it's all over the place. so much for Toyoda caring about your safety.

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2010/07/lexus_recall.html

Frosty

07-12-2010, 02:43 PM

But but they're spending a million dollars an hour to get it right :rofl: Give me a f'in break....

qwikz28

07-13-2010, 08:52 AM

They use the 3.5L motor across their product line. Why isn't cars such as the Highlander and RX350 recalled as well? I don't believe for a second that they get different manufacturers for their valve springs for different models utilizing the same engine

Clutch Master

07-17-2010, 09:45 AM

Well toyota pulled all the black boxes from all the prius' in the accidents and it showed that no brake pedal was applied and the car was at WOT. Explain that one.....

http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/2010/07/14/toyota-black-box-tests-driver-error-caused-crashes/

Mark B

07-17-2010, 10:17 AM

"The U.S. Department of Transportation has analyzed dozens of data recorders from Toyota Motor Corp. vehicles involved in accidents blamed on sudden acceleration and found that the throttles were wide open and the brakes weren't engaged at the time of the crash,"

It doesnt say how many throttles were wide open out of the "dozens" that they tested. If two throttles were open out of 3-4 dozen cars... that doesnt mean much.

And which cars did they pull the black boxes from? Probably ones that they already knew were driver error from other evidence.

Clutch Master

07-17-2010, 10:20 AM

Another thing the news "forgot" to mention that from 90% of the police reports from the deaths that they all had higher the legal limit blood alcohol level. im not defending toyota at all but it would be nice if the world gets the whole story...

Frosty

07-17-2010, 10:45 AM

Clutch Master

07-17-2010, 10:53 AM

90%? Any actual proof to back up that one?

Me not personally, Toyota has all the info from the police reports from the accidents. We we showed them when i had to go to toyota in West Caldwell.

07-17-2010, 11:20 AM

i think the bigger question is.. do the black boxes record the inputs of the driver or the actions of the car? in a perfect world those two things would be the same, and an engineer would not need to distinguish between them. However, nothing is perfect. If the car does not acknowledge a drivers input, are we sure the black box would? or is it just measuring say the throttle position sensor values... something to think about. The brake thing.. eh i dunno, but who knows anything with these electronics anymore. Maybe the brake pedal input sensors fail to read at WOT.. who knows.

maroman88

07-17-2010, 12:10 PM

SteveR

07-17-2010, 12:21 PM

FlyingDutchman

07-17-2010, 03:17 PM

yep. The boxes prove nothing. If the car fails to register the driver input, it's still a failure by the car, it's just not recorded in the box. This is yet just another attempt by Toyota to try and clear their name.

Then WTF is the point of it? I thought I had read somewhere that only the japanese had access/software to read the boxes.

Frosty

07-17-2010, 03:25 PM

Me not personally, Toyota has all the info from the police reports from the accidents. We we showed them when i had to go to toyota in West Caldwell.

So Toyota has all of the info(non-biased I'm sure) that states 90% of these accidents could have been alcohol related and they choose you/your group to share that with...c'mon.....

Tru2Chevy

07-17-2010, 04:12 PM

Then WTF is the point of it? I thought I had read somewhere that only the japanese had access/software to read the boxes.

In the article it says that Toyota provided the NHTSA with 10 devices to read the boxes back in March.

- Justin

Anti_Rice_Guy

07-19-2010, 10:49 AM

http://jalopnik.com/5588081/toyota-planted-wsj-driver-error-story-so-what

FlyingDutchman

07-19-2010, 11:25 AM

Sooo toyota made this story up to gain money and say their customers were at fault? Either that makes no sense or I read it wrong.

Anti_Rice_Guy

07-19-2010, 12:28 PM

Sooo toyota made this story up to gain money and say their customers were at fault? Either that makes no sense or I read it wrong.

According to that article, your understanding is right. Or at least it agrees with my understanding and we are both wrong then :nod:

FlyingDutchman

07-29-2010, 09:55 PM

EXTRA EXTRA TOYOTA RECALLS MORE CARS...again...

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Toyota-recalls-412000-cars-in-apf-2557643097.html?x=0

412,000 cars recalled for steering issues in the US. so far the total is about 9.5 MILLION within the last year or so.

SteveR

07-30-2010, 09:40 AM

but... but.... the commercials say they are the safest cars on the road! Aren't we supposed to believe everything we see on television?! :lol:

Frosty

07-30-2010, 09:43 AM

I guess that million dollars an hour they're spending found this problem too.

Then again maybe all these problems can be linked to this supposed police reports that say drivers are drunk. :rofl:

maroman88

08-26-2010, 02:19 PM

Toyota recalls 1.1 million Corollas, Matrixes
Thursday, August 26, 2010
Last updated: Thursday August 26, 2010, 1:59 PM
The Record
THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

NEW YORK — Toyota recalled 1.13 million Corolla sedans and Matrix hatchbacks Thursday because their engines may stall, the latest in a string of quality problems at the Japanese automaker.

The recall covers vehicles from the 2005-2008 model years sold in North America. Three accidents and one minor injury have been reported, though Toyota said a link to the engine issue has not been confirmed.

The automaker said vehicles with 1ZZ-FE engines may contain a defective engine control module, the computer that regulates the performance of the engine. In some cases, a crack may develop on the module's circuit board, which could prevent the engine from starting, harsh shifting or an engine stall.

Toyota said it will replace the engine control modules on the recalled vehicles at no charge. It will begin mailing notifications to customers with affected Corollas and Matrixes starting in mid-September.

Toyota Motor Corp. has recalled more than 10 million vehicles worldwide over the past year for a range of problems, including faulty gas pedals, floor mats that can trap accelerators and braking problems in its Prius hybrid.

Federal regulators have been investigating the possibility of engine stalls in the Corolla and Matrix models since December and intensified their probe earlier this week.

Toyota shares fell 28 cents to $68.78

12secondv6

08-26-2010, 03:57 PM

The automaker said vehicles with 1ZZ-FE engines

2JZ????

http://www.rotaryresurrection.com/klinternetfiles/forum/2jzswapwithnas.jpg

FlyingDutchman

08-26-2010, 05:24 PM

:facepalm:

BigAls87Z28

08-26-2010, 07:07 PM

10 million cars recalled in the last year. That is insane! How people continue to go to Toyota dealers and purchase vehicles is astounding.

91chevywt

08-26-2010, 10:34 PM

10 million cars recalled in the last year. That is insane! How people continue to go to Toyota dealers and purchase vehicles is astounding.

I wonder the same thing. People need to start looking beyond brand loyalty and focus on facts.

BigAls87Z28

08-26-2010, 10:38 PM

Loyalty is one thing, but people arent thinking and just walking into dealers.

LS1Hawk

08-27-2010, 08:09 AM

10 million cars recalled in the last year. That is insane! How people continue to go to Toyota dealers and purchase vehicles is astounding.

Because people are stupid. There can be 20 million cars recalled, but all Toyota has to do is put out BS ads like "we invest $1 million a day in safety" or "my Toyota has 400,000 miles on it" and the public believes it.

qwikz28

08-27-2010, 11:35 AM

"we invest $1 million a day in safety"

should really say, "the government makes us spend $1 million a day in safety through recalls"

keep in mind also guys, the reason so many cars are recalled are because they sell so many cars. if a problem affects all camrys, or all corollas, you better believe that number will be astronomical

12secondv6

08-27-2010, 08:21 PM

10 million cars recalled in the last year. That is insane! How people continue to go to Toyota dealers and purchase vehicles is astounding.

Agreed.

Tru2Chevy

08-28-2010, 03:17 PM

keep in mind also guys, the reason so many cars are recalled are because they sell so many cars. if a problem affects all camrys, or all corollas, you better believe that number will be astronomical

I understand why the actual numbers are so high. What really floors me is the percentage of their cars sold in the US that have been recalled.

This is from then end of July: http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Toyota-recalls-412000-cars-in-apf-2557643097.html?x=0

Thursday's announcement brings the size of Toyota's recalls to about 9.5 million cars and trucks in the U.S. since October, with some recalls affecting models as old as the 1998 model year. That means of the 24.1 million vehicles Toyota has sold in the U.S. since 1998, as tracked by Wards AutoInfoBank, Toyota has recalled about 39 percent.

So add another 1.1 million cars to that recall total (now 10.6 million), and you are looking at roughly 43%-44% of all vehicles that Toyota has sold in the United States in the last 12 years has been recalled within the last 10 months.

That's insane......

- Justin

FlyingDutchman

10-21-2010, 12:01 PM

I hope we all didn't forget about our no. 1 automaker who is leading the way in quality and safety ...

Another 1.53 million cars recalled for brake/fuel pump problems

http://autos.yahoo.com/articles/autos_content_landing_pages/1553/toyota-recalling-153-million-cars-globally/

SteveR

10-29-2010, 04:19 PM

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20101029/ts_nm/us_toyota_litigation

NastyEllEssWon

10-29-2010, 04:55 PM

toyota = effed

Knipps

10-30-2010, 02:23 PM

nah, people these days have short memories and are stubborn. It'll take something ridiculously drastic for them to take notice

LS1Hawk

02-08-2011, 01:16 PM

A lengthy investigation by NASA into last year's Toyota Motor (http://online.wsj.com/public/quotes/main.html?type=djn&symbol=tm) Corp. recalls found that engine electronics played no role in incidents of sudden, unintended acceleration of its cars, U.S. officials said Tuesday....

The investigation is likely to be the definitive study into Toyota's recall of more than 8 million starting in November 2009.Full article: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704364004576132351264140850.html?m od=googlenews_wsj